Ultramontane conservatives in catholic church of Scotland defying Scottish society

Lumpy Talbot

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Beset by issues similar to the catholic church in Ireland and elsewhere around the world (failure to deal fairly with survivors of abuse, guilty of assuming press statements are enough, a defensive mentality towards real problems within the organisation) it seems that the organisation there is in something of a major crisis.

' Deveney subsequently received a slew of deeply unpleasant communications from senior church officials for having done so. She had come up against “the Scottish inquisition”, a small cadre of hard-right and ultra-traditional lay officers who now wield disproportionate influence at all levels of the church in the absence of anything resembling proper leadership.'

As the catholic church in Scotland slides further into ethical turpitude there are reports even of attempts at intimidation at anyone who questions hard-line conservative catholic maneouvers. Described as 'a vindictive group of reactionaries and ultramontanes who rail against Pope Francis’s compassion and understanding for gay Catholics and divorcees. Instead they would rather intimidate pregnant women seeking an abortion with all-night vigils outside hospitals, the Catholic equivalent of a picket line.'

Some observers are predicting that the catholic church in Scotland is in deep decline and may not survive the century if led by its currently ethically blind leadership without change.

'The Catholic church in Scotland is in deep, deep crisis.' Interesting comment also in this article about attempted intimidation by two former police officers working for a private security company.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/07/sex-abuse-survivors-catholic-church-scotland

While few in the Irish catholic church would advocate now a policy of attempted intimidation in tandem with ignoral of survivor groups it seems the catholic church in Scotland is in the group of some organisationally suicidal types.

And interestingly it seems that the tone is being set by fanatical/extremist lay catholics in many cases.
 


Fellow

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"Described as 'a vindictive group of reactionaries and ultramontanes who rail against Pope Francis’s compassion and understanding for gay Catholics....."
So they're both ultramontane and against the Pope.
 

firefly123

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Oh well.

They had a good run.
 

hollandia

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"Described as 'a vindictive group of reactionaries and ultramontanes who rail against Pope Francis’s compassion and understanding for gay Catholics....."
So they're both ultramontane and against the Pope.
Sounds like one of our more well known posters...
 

Clanrickard

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Beset by issues similar to the catholic church in Ireland and elsewhere around the world (failure to deal fairly with survivors of abuse, guilty of assuming press statements are enough, a defensive mentality towards real problems within the organisation) it seems that the organisation there is in something of a major crisis.

' Deveney subsequently received a slew of deeply unpleasant communications from senior church officials for having done so. She had come up against “the Scottish inquisition”, a small cadre of hard-right and ultra-traditional lay officers who now wield disproportionate influence at all levels of the church in the absence of anything resembling proper leadership.'

As the catholic church in Scotland slides further into ethical turpitude there are reports even of attempts at intimidation at anyone who questions hard-line conservative catholic maneouvers. Described as 'a vindictive group of reactionaries and ultramontanes who rail against Pope Francis’s compassion and understanding for gay Catholics and divorcees. Instead they would rather intimidate pregnant women seeking an abortion with all-night vigils outside hospitals, the Catholic equivalent of a picket line.'

Some observers are predicting that the catholic church in Scotland is in deep decline and may not survive the century if led by its currently ethically blind leadership without change.

'The Catholic church in Scotland is in deep, deep crisis.' Interesting comment also in this article about attempted intimidation by two former police officers working for a private security company.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jan/07/sex-abuse-survivors-catholic-church-scotland

While few in the Irish catholic church would advocate now a policy of attempted intimidation in tandem with ignoral of survivor groups it seems the catholic church in Scotland is in the group of some organisationally suicidal types.

And interestingly it seems that the tone is being set by fanatical/extremist lay catholics in many cases.
The Guardian on the Catholic Church? Seriously?
 

publicrealm

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"Described as 'a vindictive group of reactionaries and ultramontanes who rail against Pope Francis’s compassion and understanding for gay Catholics....."
So they're both ultramontane and against the Pope.
Ahh - but Bergoglio is not the Pope y'see - Pope Emeritus Benedict is manifestly still wearing white papal undies and is therefore the true Pope according to the experts - albeit not up to their desired standard.

So no conflict there.
 

Windowshopper

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I think the article loses credibility when he accuses, what I assume, are Labour and the Nats of trying to create 'a totalitarian atheist state'. McKenna has being banging the Cathlic education drum in apocalyptic terms for years now.
 

Casablanca

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Ahh - but Bergoglio is not the Pope y'see - Pope Emeritus Benedict is manifestly still wearing white papal undies and is therefore the true Pope according to the experts - albeit not up to their desired standard.

So no conflict there.
Y’see, that’s the sort of detail that the lamesteam churnalists like the ISIS Times Technology Pages don’t report.

Another scoop for P.ie!
 

Toland

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"Described as 'a vindictive group of reactionaries and ultramontanes who rail against Pope Francis’s compassion and understanding for gay Catholics....."
So they're both ultramontane and against the Pope.
The hatred among those associated with Opus Dei of anything Jesuit is powerful enough to admit the most obvious of contradictions.
 

Clanrickard

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Just read the article, rather than shooting the messenger as he comes into sight in the distance.
What would you say they have reported inaccurately? And can you give us a better source of information on the issues raised?
A lot of this is unsourced here say. Lets say the Guardian has form when reporting on Christian themes and mews items. Such an article would never be written about the Jewish or Islamic faiths.
 

mr_anderson

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Ahh - but Bergoglio is not the Pope y'see - Pope Emeritus Benedict is manifestly still wearing white papal undies and is therefore the true Pope according to the experts - albeit not up to their desired standard.

So no conflict there.
''you-know-who'' just got an alert on his phone about your post.
He'll be here just after all Sunday masses have been attended.
 

Toland

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A lot of this is unsourced here say. Lets say the Guardian has form when reporting on Christian themes and mews items. Such an article would never be written about the Jewish or Islamic faiths.
The Jewish or Islamic "faiths" are not associated with the same crimes. They have other stuff to defend themselves from.

Also, Catholicism is associated with a single authoritarian institution, which is not the case either for Judaism or Islam.

In short, your point is either ill explained or just sheer nonsense.

What bits are hearsay?

hearsay

You're welcome.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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Well it wouldn't be unique to the catholic church- indeed we know some of these issues are more to do with religious organisations effectively regarding themselves and being treated as above possible reproach in matters of abuse and cover-up.

There have been similar issues with Protestant and Anglican religious groups and certainly I am aware of similar issues within jewish circles in New York which have also been well publicised.

I am not certain of the extent to which adherents of the other cults have dived into the notion that they are being martyred though through these revelations about the behaviour of many of their clerics.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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A guardian article covering issues of sexual abuse by rabbis in New York. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/mar/29/brooklyn-orthodox-jews-child-abuse-cover-up-feature

Guardian coverage of the extent of abuse within Anglican church circles in Australia;

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2017/mar/17/royal-commission-reveals-scale-of-child-sexual-abuse-in-anglican-church

Guardian coverage of the sexual abuse issues within the Methodist church;

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/may/29/protestants-abuse-catholics-methodist-church

The Guardian on abuse in Muslim communities; https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2010/apr/25/middle-east-child-abuse-pederasty

I think that answers that particular whinge.
 

Cruimh

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Y’see, that’s the sort of detail that the lamesteam churnalists like the ISIS Times Technology Pages don’t report.

Another scoop for P.ie!
I wonder what detergent they use to keep them pristine and sparkling white?
Are they a Blue White?
Do they use a special fabric conditioner?
Who washes them? I'm sure the laity wouldn/t be allowed to see Papal Skids ....
 

Clanrickard

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The Jewish or Islamic "faiths" are not associated with the same crimes. They have other stuff to defend themselves from.

Also, Catholicism is associated with a single authoritarian institution, which is not the case either for Judaism or Islam.

In short, your point is either ill explained or just sheer nonsense.

What bits are hearsay?

hearsay

You're welcome.
The bits that are unattributed.
 


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