Under strict rent controls advocated by some for Ireland, ruthless and criminal landlords might displace many honest landlords

patslatt

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 11, 2007
Messages
13,637
Under strict rent controls advocated by some for Ireland, ruthless and criminal landlords might displace many honest landlords

Naive, envious and economically illiterate advocates of strict rent controls and sitting tenancies for Ireland ignore the fact that ruthless and criminal landlords eventually become a serious force in such rental markets. By getting rid of rent control tenants, landlords can profit hugely from steep rent increases.

In London in the 1960s and 1970s, a landlord named Rachman gave the name "Rachmanism" to the nasty tactics he used to build his property empire. He typically rented flats to hired thugs whose deliberate antisocial behaviour frightened tenants into leaving. The thugs would behave noisily at all hours and urinate in stairways, for instance.

An article in Bloomberg BusinessWeek describes nasty tactics by one of New York City's biggest landlords The Landlord His tactics included:

[]Remove the communal washing machine
[]Replace a good superintendent of a high rise building with a useless part time one
[]Cut off water
[]Allow pests like rodents to go unchecked
[]Sever phone lines
[]Leave holes in ceilings
[]File frivolous lawsuits against tenants
[]Hire an ex-cop to stalk tenants
[]Perform illegal and unsafe construction on apartments to disturb tenants nearby
[]Cut off gas and electricity
[]Leave mould and water damage unrepaired
[]Serve eviction threats and false debt collection letters to intimidate tenants into selling out for modest compensation
[]Install the lowest quality appliances like showers, dishwashers and dryers and refuse to replace them on breakdown

New York City's very strict and vexatious rent controls that suppress high rents are easily exploited by criminal and ruthless landlords. Also,in the least attractive areas of the city, vast unsightly slums developed as landlords abandoned buildings in the past.

In Ireland, even if a ruthless class of landlords didn't emerge, no doubt strict rent controls would result in neglect of building maintenance,deteriorating accomodation and a disappearance of private investment in new rental housing.

Let's hope Minister Simon Coveney will get rid of the red tape that is blocking housing building in Dublin and Cork by removing planning permissions from councils that pander to NIMBY home owners who typically have a high voter turnout.
 
Last edited:


patslatt

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 11, 2007
Messages
13,637
In view of the explosion in rents, the lack of comments on this topic is surprising.
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
Well, then deal with that problem.
Let's not give up on social ideals so easily.
The argument fails on so many levels.
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
The answer lies in properly planned social housing, and not to build working class ghettos, it should be the default option for all.

From there, people can save a deposit and move on to purchase a mortgage if they so wish.

And this should not cost the state a fortune; why on earth cannot good quality housing be built simply and cheaply with today's technology? Why does one have to work their whole lives to pay the mortgage for a roof over the head?
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
The answer lies in properly planned social housing, and not to build working class ghettos, it should be the default option for all.

From there, people can save a deposit and move on to purchase a mortgage if they so wish.

And this should not cost the state a fortune; why on earth cannot good quality housing be built simply and cheaply with today's technology? Why does one have to work their whole lives to pay the mortgage for a roof over the head?
Of course, the question is rhetorical. The priority is to keep the market afloat. To keep the working man and woman spend their lives transferring their hard earned money from one rich bastard to another.

The presence of greedy landlords, sub-standard social housing and dire homelessness are allowed to exist, so as to serve as a threat to those working people; pay up or this could happen to you.
 

fat finger

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 22, 2016
Messages
2,216
Berlin is perhaps the most rent controlled city in Europe if not the world.
Its low rents draw in entrepreneurs and creatives from all over Germany and beyond.
But no one ever mentions a problem with criminal ruthless landlords there - why not?
Berlin is the model that Dublin authorities should be applying to solve the rent gouging of young couples and families.
Berlin proves that rent controls work.
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
Berlin is perhaps the most rent controlled city in Europe if not the world.
Its low rents draw in entrepreneurs and creatives from all over Germany and beyond.
But no one ever mentions a problem with criminal ruthless landlords there - why not?
Berlin is the model that Dublin authorities should be applying to solve the rent gouging of young couples and families.
Berlin proves that rent controls work.
Good point about Berlin.

Central London has become gentrified and owned by Saudi billionaires.
Meanwhile, the workers are pushed out, and have to commute long distances.

Cities need a diversity and locality to thrive; only a properly managed and affordable housing policy can do that.
 

talkingshop

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2011
Messages
26,677
The answer lies in properly planned social housing, and not to build working class ghettos, it should be the default option for all.

From there, people can save a deposit and move on to purchase a mortgage if they so wish.

And this should not cost the state a fortune; why on earth cannot good quality housing be built simply and cheaply with today's technology? Why does one have to work their whole lives to pay the mortgage for a roof over the head?
it costs what it costs - up to €300,000 to build a 3 bedroom house in some areas (or more maybe?) taking into account land costs and building costs. How do you suggest we magically make it cheaper?
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
it costs what it costs - up to €300,000 to build a 3 bedroom house in some areas (or more maybe?) taking into account land costs and building costs. How do you suggest we magically make it cheaper?
I'm sure that it could. There is a lot of market-built cost in housing. The government is guilty of this too. It could be made simpler and cheaper if the political will was there.

What about these Ikea-type homes, flat-pak stuff, simply assembled; with state intervention, and economies of scale that come from it, social housing could out-compete the rigged mortgage market.
 

talkingshop

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2011
Messages
26,677
I'm sure that it could. There is a lot of market-built cost in housing. The government is guilty of this too. It could be made simpler and cheaper if the political will was there.

What about these Ikea-type homes, flat-pak stuff, simply assembled; with state intervention, and economies of scale that come from it, social housing could out-compete the rigged mortgage market.
Was listening to a piece on the radio the other day - the modular homes they are building in Dublin (Finglas or Ballymun, I think) have turned out to be dearer than conventional houses (and they only last 60 years). To make it cheaper, it would have to be being done on a huge scale. I don't mean to be negative, but I don't think there are simple or easy solutions to this.
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
Was listening to a piece on the radio the other day - the modular homes they are building in Dublin (Finglas or Ballymun, I think) have turned out to be dearer than conventional houses (and they only last 60 years). To make it cheaper, it would have to be being done on a huge scale. I don't mean to be negative, but I don't think there are simple or easy solutions to this.
Yeah, I'm sure it's not simple. But we could learn from other countries; we should not be faced with this crisis here.

I don't have the solution, and I don't know about the technicalities, but I do think that the current state is working within an economically driven mindset, without having a clear social vision, and determination to carry it through.

I think it could be done, and we deserve better.
 

Texal Tom

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2011
Messages
2,423
Twitter
Don't tweet
A key reason that we have an accommodation crisis is that private investors didn't privately invest in property over the last 7 years.

Keeping a house in good shape is costly on an annual basis - insurance / property taxes / repairs / possibly management charges / new appliances / renovations / money costs money to borrow / negative equity stress /

If these lefties had their way Dublin would be one big ballymun of old. Landlords are not the problem but are part of the solution - encourage investment as the state we live in is a limited in many ways. In socialist and communist societies housing is never the problem - their problem is trying to get the people to stay -
 

Texal Tom

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2011
Messages
2,423
Twitter
Don't tweet
Have you tried relating it to immigrants or abortion?
Are you saying that a large influx of immigrants who just land on your shores are not going to have an impact on housing supplies?
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
A key reason that we have an accommodation crisis is that private investors didn't privately invest in property over the last 7 years.

Keeping a house in good shape is costly on an annual basis - insurance / property taxes / repairs / possibly management charges / new appliances / renovations / money costs money to borrow / negative equity stress /

If these lefties had their way Dublin would be one big ballymun of old. Landlords are not the problem but are part of the solution - encourage investment as the state we live in is a limited in many ways. In socialist and communist societies housing is never the problem - their problem is trying to get the people to stay -
We need a mix of the two, of course. I'm convinced that a properly run social housing program could facilitate a healthy private housing market. What we have now are dysfunctional public and private housing markets. And it is the state that bears ultimate responsibility for that.


EDIT: E.g. Young couples could save for a mortgage while living in social housing, in a way they cannot do under private landlords, given the rent crisis.
 

talkingshop

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 9, 2011
Messages
26,677
A key reason that we have an accommodation crisis is that private investors didn't privately invest in property over the last 7 years.

Keeping a house in good shape is costly on an annual basis - insurance / property taxes / repairs / possibly management charges / new appliances / renovations / money costs money to borrow / negative equity stress /

If these lefties had their way Dublin would be one big ballymun of old. Landlords are not the problem but are part of the solution - encourage investment as the state we live in is a limited in many ways. In socialist and communist societies housing is never the problem - their problem is trying to get the people to stay -
I think also the increased protections for tenants have driven would-be landlords out of the market. I mean if an ordinary person has an empty house (say left by a parent, and they haven't decided to sell it yet, e.g), previously they might have rented it out; but the new protections for tenants mean that if you get a difficult tenant, who stops paying the rent, it takes about a year, and a lot of effort, to get them out, not to mention the upgrading that would be required to get it to a legally acceptable standard now. Not saying protections for tenants are bad, but they are having the consequence that people will leave properties empty rather than go to the hassle, and risk, of renting them out...seemingly good moves can have negative consequences.
 

Texal Tom

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2011
Messages
2,423
Twitter
Don't tweet
Social housing is very costly - social housing is usually much more expensive to build and the admin and servicing by council workers continues to be more costly and the end product is a place that most people don't want to live in and criminality and drugs takes over.

Social housing really means that someone is not only paying for their own house but they carry the burden for another family - this other family rarely appreciate the sacrifices the working family make and this is never pointed out
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
Social housing is very costly - social housing is usually much more expensive to build and the admin and servicing by council workers continues to be more costly and the end product is a place that most people don't want to live in and criminality and drugs takes over.

Social housing really means that someone is not only paying for their own house but they carry the burden for another family - this other family rarely appreciate the sacrifices the working family make and this is never pointed out
No. The state has the ability to generate economies of scale in a way the family cannot. But, even more so, it has the ability to reorganise the market that cuts out the middle man and red tape.

It can be done, but requires a social vision that our current government does not have.
 

igCorcaigh

Well-known member
Joined
May 10, 2011
Messages
772
And if anyone is worried about tax based subsidies, look at the current dysfunctional rent allowance system. That was supposed to be temporary, decades ago.

That's where your tax euros are going, into the private landlords, at a market driven price.

How much cheaper, and how more humanitarian it would be to have a proper and popular social housing program, where all can go.
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top