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Unionist or Loyalist


devonish

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Dec 19, 2012
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With all of the attention given to the loyalist fleg protestors I was just wondering how people from either side determine or classify someone as a unionist as opposed to a loyalist? personally I associate the term loyalist with paramilitaries and flute bands and voting mainly DUP (or PUP).
On the other side of the divide I would classify SF supporters & dissidents as republicans, SDLP as nationalist, is this overly simplisitic?
 


Northtipp

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Nov 23, 2010
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With all of the attention given to the loyalist fleg protestors I was just wondering how people from either side determine or classify someone as a unionist as opposed to a loyalist? personally I associate the term loyalist with paramilitaries and flute bands and voting mainly DUP (or PUP).
On the other side of the divide I would classify SF supporters & dissidents as republicans, SDLP as nationalist, is this overly simplisitic?
Are you eamon Mallie.

@EamonnMallie: Are Loyalists like 'white trash' in eyes of middle class Unionists? Question posed by Paul Hagan-Rea .... Are Loyalists like 'white trash' in the eyes of middle class Unionists? Paul Hagan-Rea asks
 

belfast1981

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Aug 23, 2012
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I would consider myself a non-loyalist Unionist. I do think similar to you that Republican/Loyalists are the more extreme side of the fence. Where as Nationalist/Unionist to be more moderate.

Off course, all loyalists are Unionist, and all Republicans are Nationalist.
 

Global Justice

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Aug 4, 2011
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I believe Sgt. Bigot a few moments ago said something along the lines of calling a spade a spade...

It is time to call a spade a spade. As someone born off the Shankill Road into the Protestant working class, I find myself saddened and bemused by the neverending bigotry, stupidity, fascism and futility of Loyalism that was yet again manifest in the recent protests.
Humani: The humanist association of Northern Ireland

I see no real difference between unionism and loyalism. Both will fap furiously over anything wrapped in the butchers apron. There's plenty of unionist orange-men who partake in loyalist bands and marching with fervent but deluded and an ever decaying no surrender metality
 

eoghanacht

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Apr 18, 2006
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Unionist = Upper/middle class, willing to manipulate what they deem 'lower orders', Drumcree etc, more likely to incite sectarian violence/pogroms [hate speech] or being seen to be able to incite them but who will invariably stand back and claim innocence somoene gets hurt

Loyalists = the plebs that can be whipped up into a sectarian frenzy at the drop of a hat but are the disenfranchised rump of the Irish-Brits, useful idiots some might say.
 

devonish

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RedCloud

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I would never label myself 'loyalist', as, as has been already stated, it has too many connotations with murder gangs.
Far too many of our nat/rep chums seem to wallow in the cowardly, pira death squad sycophancy, and I, in all honesty, feel nothing but sympathy for them.
Thankfully, they have no counterparts from the Unionist Community on P.ie. :)
 

physicist

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Mar 29, 2010
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With all of the attention given to the loyalist fleg protestors I was just wondering how people from either side determine or classify someone as a unionist as opposed to a loyalist? personally I associate the term loyalist with paramilitaries and flute bands and voting mainly DUP (or PUP).
On the other side of the divide I would classify SF supporters & dissidents as republicans, SDLP as nationalist, is this overly simplisitic?
It probably is over simplification, Billy Wright once criticised Billy Hutchinson for his left wing politics saying that pro-union beliefs aside Hutchinson was republican.
 

devonish

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Unionist = Upper/middle class, willing to manipulate what they deem 'lower orders', Drumcree etc, more likely to incite sectarian violence/pogroms [hate speech] or being seen to be able to incite them but who will invariably stand back and claim innocence somoene gets hurt

Loyalists = the plebs that can be whipped up into a sectarian frenzy at the drop of a hat but are the disenfranchised rump of the Irish-Brits, useful idiots some might say.
A bit simplisitc, you assume a willingness or desire to incite violence amongst unionists, I just know too many like minded who clearly view such actions as being counter productive and not beneficial to NI.
 

eoghanacht

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A bit simplisitc, you assume a willingness or desire to incite violence amongst unionists, I just know too many like minded who clearly view such actions as being counter productive and not beneficial to NI.
I would be thinking of Paisley especially, he was more than willing to use the mob for his own ends and I mentioned Drumcree because who could forget Trimble manning the ramparts as it where :lol:

Unionist maybe would see them selves as the officer class and Loyalists are the foot soldiers/pawns.
 

RedCloud

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Nov 1, 2012
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Unionists are organised loyalists - but both still leaderless nonetheless.
Ah, if only we had a Jarry to lead us. The shining example of West Belfast opulence is there for all to see ? :)
 

SgtBilko

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Feb 11, 2011
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With all of the attention given to the loyalist fleg protestors I was just wondering how people from either side determine or classify someone as a unionist as opposed to a loyalist? personally I associate the term loyalist with paramilitaries and flute bands and voting mainly DUP (or PUP).
On the other side of the divide I would classify SF supporters & dissidents as republicans, SDLP as nationalist, is this overly simplisitic?
I think both the terms Loyalist and Republican have been hijacked and sullied by militant criminal scumbags on both sides. Neither are honourable labels to be given these days.
 

Global Justice

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Ah, if only we had a Jarry to lead us. The shining example of West Belfast opulence is there for all to see ? :)
Wherever in the O6C are examples of British imperialism and rampant capitalism, nothing to do with Gerry. All fall under the governance of British rule in Ireland.

Though it must make you sick seeing Gerry now an actual statesman, instead of ill-disciplined, ill-educated ill-cultured and ill-mannered political unionists and loyalists :lol:
 

Drogheda445

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Feb 13, 2012
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With all of the attention given to the loyalist fleg protestors I was just wondering how people from either side determine or classify someone as a unionist as opposed to a loyalist? personally I associate the term loyalist with paramilitaries and flute bands and voting mainly DUP (or PUP).
On the other side of the divide I would classify SF supporters & dissidents as republicans, SDLP as nationalist, is this overly simplisitic?
Both loyalist and republican have different meanings today than those they had before the Troubles. A loyalist before Troubles meant a person loyal to the Crown and to the Union, opposed to a unionist who would simply have wanted union and not necessarily out of loyalty. A republican was someone who purely wanted a United Irish republic (some early nationalists would have been monarchists as well). Today however, both terms mean the militant, extremist fringe of unionism and nationalism. Self-proclaimed loyalists would also often, as Garret Fitzgerald put it, have only shown "loyalty to Ulster, not to the Union with Britain". Unionism therefore came to embody simply the entire pro-Union movement, mainly the moderate, constitutional faction.

So if anything, the terms have been hijacked by extremists far beyond what they once meant.
 

Drogheda445

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Also bear in mind that republican in British terms means supporting the abolishment of the monarchy, not a supporter of Irish unity or a dissident. Calling yourself a "unionist republican" would make sense in Great Britain but would sound like an oxymoron in Northern Ireland.
 

runwiththewind

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Wherever in the O6C are examples of British imperialism and rampant capitalism, nothing to do with Gerry. All fall under the governance of British rule in Ireland.

Though it must make you sick seeing Gerry now an actual statesman, instead of ill-disciplined, ill-educated ill-cultured and ill-mannered political unionists and loyalists :lol:
Still, with Gerry at the helm, SF will make no further headway in the Rep and SF know this, but will they act?
 

devonish

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I would be thinking of Paisley especially, he was more than willing to use the mob for his own ends and I mentioned Drumcree because who could forget Trimble manning the ramparts as it where :lol:

Unionist maybe would see them selves as the officer class and Loyalists are the foot soldiers/pawns.
Well, that's more about the dirty game which politicians get involved in. I'm thinking more about the general population.
 

death or glory

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As I consider myselfboth loyalist and a unionist. IMO unionists are polititians and loyalists are the voters.
 

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