We Deserve the IMF

thetruthsback

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While I agree Fianna Fail made an absolute mess of the country, are we all not responsible? Did we forget ourselves, lost in materialism??? I am afraid we elected the government and what about the opposition, did they cry stop at the last election? As for the media, pages and pages of the property section tells its own story.
 


dresden8

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While I agree Fianna Fail made an absolute mess of the country, are we all not responsible? Did we forget ourselves, lost in materialism??? I am afraid we elected the government and what about the opposition, did they cry stop at the last election? As for the media, pages and pages of the property section tells its own story.
Stick your "We" sh1t up your hole!
 

TonyBird

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Yes , we all bought into the pyramid scam of property and credit .
Though for the record , I didnt .

We mostly voted for 'financial liberal' parties .
Though again , for the record , I must say , I didnt.

But at the end of the day , your proposition is correct , imo.
 

Iarmuid

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While I agree Fianna Fail made an absolute mess of the country, are we all not responsible? Did we forget ourselves, lost in materialism??? I am afraid we elected the government and what about the opposition, did they cry stop at the last election? As for the media, pages and pages of the property section tells its own story.
Is this the we you mean




The charity says that there are up to 5,000 homeless people nationwide and 100,000 households are on social housing waiting lists.

or this we





Over 76,000 children in Ireland live in consistent poverty today
or this we



Because I think we all know which WEs will grow in number and ultimately pay for front loading odious debt on to the PAYE worker and which WE will be made whole.
 
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FreshStart

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Speak for yourself. I worked full-time for six years with small children and finally went part time because I was fed up paying E1,500 in childcare costs per month. The Celtic Tiger didn't land on parents. How dare anyone suggest I was greedy and had lost the run of myself. I shopped in Dunnes and Marks & Sparks. I drove a banger (and still do). I also invested in a small family home in a good school district.

I do not for one minute believe I am the only who watched the Celtic Tiger as a spectator!
 

Ingersoll

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Speak for yourself. I worked full-time for six years with small children and finally went part time because I was fed up paying E1,500 in childcare costs per month. The Celtic Tiger didn't land on parents. How dare anyone suggest I was greedy and had lost the run of myself. I shopped in Dunnes and Marks & Sparks. I drove a banger (and still do). I also invested in a small family home in a good school district.

I do not for one minute believe I am the only who watched the Celtic Tiger as a spectator!
+1,
Count me out as well, we have kids, have not had a holiday since 2001 and do not own a holiday home. Both the good and the bad of the Celtic pyramid scheme bypassed my family and i am both disgusted at our government, banking and professional classes and grateful i still have a job. So stick your 'we' up your arse.
 

TonyBird

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Speak for yourself. I worked full-time for six years with small children and finally went part time because I was fed up paying E1,500 in childcare costs per month. The Celtic Tiger didn't land on parents. How dare anyone suggest I was greedy and had lost the run of myself. I shopped in Dunnes and Marks & Sparks. I drove a banger (and still do). I also invested in a small family home in a good school district.

I do not for one minute believe I am the only who watched the Celtic Tiger as a spectator!
Noone is calling anyone 'greedy' . However , intelligent people must surely have seen the writing on the wall ? Am I wrong ?
 

kerdasi amaq

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Number2

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The 'we' are the Fianna Fail voters who let themselves be bought at election time, because they had more greed than sense.
The 'we' are the unions who negotiated 'upwards only' benchmarking.
The 'we' are the ones who snapped-up 35year 100% mortgages. The same 'we' who now want a taxpayer bailout.
 

TonyBird

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Give it a rest with the 'holier than thou' crap . We were all spongers !
(except the self employed, god bless em )
 

Iarmuid

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The 'we' are the Fianna Fail voters who let themselves be bought at election time, because they had more greed than sense.
The 'we' are the unions who negotiated 'upwards only' benchmarking.
The 'we' are the ones who snapped-up 35year 100% mortgages. The same 'we' who now want a taxpayer bailout.
There is only "them" - the criminal fraudsters who blew a world wide property bubble not just in Ireland and those who engaged in wilful deciet and us everyone else whom are expected to pay for the malfeasance.

This is where this story is at - the system needs reforming and cleansing (criminal investigations and prosecutions) and that is going to require more then navel gazing in the form of analysing the past actions of unions and people who will soon lose homes for taking out the 35 year 100% mortgages.

PS. the corruption is not localised to Ireland, have a google on the Mortgage paper scandal in the US. The peasants there are paying just like here, it is just not yet as acute in broad terms, but I believe it will be.
 
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ocoonassa

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While I agree Fianna Fail made an absolute mess of the country, are we all not responsible? Did we forget ourselves, lost in materialism???
One million of us, shítloads, don't even vote for these crooked incompetents on offer, and not all of us are greedy f*cks consuming because the TV says to.

You might be responsible, or rather irresponsible, but not "we"
 

TonyBird

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So , is there even a 'we' anymore ? Or is it 'us and them' ?
If so etc....
 

Iarmuid

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So , is there even a 'we' anymore ? Or is it 'us and them' ?
If so etc....
well Tony there are some, whom seemingly, demand a taxonomy. If there is to be one it should be those who engaged in malfeasance (them) and those who did not (us) imo. Rather meaningless, but less so then, "we".
 
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NYCKY

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While I agree Fianna Fail made an absolute mess of the country, are we all not responsible? Did we forget ourselves, lost in materialism??? I am afraid we elected the government and what about the opposition, did they cry stop at the last election? As for the media, pages and pages of the property section tells its own story.
This is one of the most sensible posts I have seen here for some time. Bertie was elected Taoiseach three times, despite plenty of alternatives. Each time he won against different Fine Gael AND different Labour leaders.

Who were the ones buying and flipping properties. Why did people buy properties that had grossly over inflated prices. People lied on mortgage applications pretending that they were going to rent out rooms, with no intention of ever doing so.

Lets not forget the flash cars on show everywhere, its not like anyone tired to hide them in their garages, shopping trips to NY, Polish maids, bouncy castles. People didn't care how this all happened as long as the good times rolled. Is this what happened to all the SSIA money?

I know not everyone jumped on the gaudy bandwagon but plenty did, and it wasn't just the bankers and developers.
 

politicaldonations

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Fianna Fail got relected twice as they were giving the people (the "we") what they wanted.
Childrens allowance, Social welfare, Public sector pay and pensions all were much higher than they would otherwise have been if the bubble hadnt occured and if FF werent allowed to pump the bubble of illusory wealth up to such preposterous levels.
YES, even those on welfare all thru the 2000s got much more than they would have if the bubble hadnt of raged on for the whole decade.
 

Iarmuid

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Fianna Fail got relected twice as they were giving the people (the "we") what they wanted.
Childrens allowance, Social welfare, Public sector pay and pensions all were much higher than they would otherwise have been if the bubble hadnt occured and if FF werent allowed to pump the bubble of illusory wealth up to such preposterous levels.
YES, even those on welfare all thru the 2000s got much more than they would have if the bubble hadnt of raged on for the whole decade.
I missed the part where the people receiving Childrens allowance, Social welfare, Public sector pay and pensions lied to the government about the worth of assets and received 10s of billions in tax payer funding for mal investments - that is some of the malfeasance part in case you missed it.
 

politicaldonations

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I missed the part where the people receiving Childrens allowance, Social welfare, Public sector pay and pensions lied to the government about the worth of assets and received 10s of billions in tax payer funding for mal investments - that is some of the malfeasance part in case you missed it.
welare/childrens allowance, ten billion a year greater than it would have been by ten years equals a hundred billion. The malinvested money was largely funnelled to public servants,social welfare payments, consumer spending by average person.
 

Iarmuid

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welare/childrens allowance, ten billion a year greater than it would have been by ten years equals a hundred billion. The malinvested money was largely funnelled to public servants,social welfare payments, consumer spending by average person.
Your problem and issue appear to lie in the nature of representative democracy - there in lies the tyranny of the majority, however the sovereign's current difficulties are caused in large by a net transfer of FUTURE earnings to the banking sector, these FUTURE earning are now interest bearing LIABILITIES and unsupportable as is. The problems you describe might be alleviated \ rectified by teaching philosophy and political science in our schools, the debt issues faced by Ireland and other places will only be solved when justice is restored.
 
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