We think things are tough now :(

hammer

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 6, 2009
Messages
58,180
Wait until the banks increase interest rates to SMEs and mortgage holders :(

The budget will decimate your disposable income and then in 2011 the banks will come a calling :(

Permanent TSB have already told BTL property investors that they need to start repaying capital.

Rent relief is being abolished and rent allowance is being cut.

Investors could barely pay interest on their mortgages.

Throw in property tax, water rates, increased ESB charges and increase to home insurance you have a PERFECT STORM :(

2011 will not be bumpy, it could be devastation for home owners.
 


The Lapsed Accountant

Active member
Joined
Dec 2, 2010
Messages
137
Permanent TSB have already told BTL property investors that they need to start repaying capital.

.
Were they giving interest only loans for BTL ?? I have a small apartment which I am letting out and am repaying capital from day 1 (thankfully bought a few years back so not the end of the world).

Cant believe permo were so silly.....but then again....
 

yoganmahew

Active member
Joined
Mar 19, 2010
Messages
170
Were they giving interest only loans for BTL ?? I have a small apartment which I am letting out and am repaying capital from day 1 (thankfully bought a few years back so not the end of the world).

Cant believe permo were so silly.....but then again....
Goodness, where have you been?

You'd want to see some of the schemes some of your non-lapsed brethren were advising... "sure isn't the interest tax free? You'd be mad to pay back capital when you get free carry on the interest".
 

Berty

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Joined
Nov 9, 2010
Messages
964
Yes, this budget along with its knock on effects will decimate the society in which we live. And let's not forget that there will be many more budgets to come in order to try to keep up with paying the interest rates set by the new masters, and of course there will be regular checks by them and many adjustments to come.

Without stimulus for growth in this 4 yr plan the potential for creating an economic wasteland will follow. But of course none of this will feel real until it happens. The 4 yr plan was of course welcomed by the EU/ECB & IMF because they don't give a toss, all they want is for the Euro to be protected, no matter what happens here.

As has been said, this crisis has shown, now more than ever, that it's capitalism for the people and socialism for the banks. The banks will of course raise their interest rates because they have shareholders to answer to as that's the nature of the business they are in, but they (or at least some of them) should have been allowed to go to the wall because that's the risk all companies, private and plc, take in the jungle of business.

Bailing out the banks by the tax payer was the ultimate and unforgivable trespass that will, in effect, push the very taxpayers, who have worked so hard to maintain their lives for their families, into very hard times. Let's hope that this will not be the beginning of the descent from civilisation into the law of the jungle. :(
 

Insole

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Joined
Nov 3, 2010
Messages
516
Yes, this budget along with its knock on effects will decimate the society in which we live. And let's not forget that there will be many more budgets to come in order to try to keep up with paying the interest rates set by the new masters, and of course there will be regular checks by them and many adjustments to come.

Without stimulus for growth in this 4 yr plan the potential for creating an economic wasteland will follow. But of course none of this will feel real until it happens. The 4 yr plan was of course welcomed by the EU/ECB & IMF because they don't give a toss, all they want is for the Euro to be protected, no matter what happens here.

As has been said, this crisis has shown, now more than ever, that it's capitalism for the people and socialism for the banks. The banks will of course raise their interest rates because they have shareholders to answer to as that's the nature of the business they are in, but they (or at least some of them) should have been allowed to go to the wall because that's the risk all companies, private and plc, take in the jungle of business.

Bailing out the banks by the tax payer was the ultimate and unforgivable trespass that will, in effect, push the very taxpayers, who have worked so hard to maintain their lives for their families, into very hard times. Let's hope that this will not be the beginning of the descent from civilisation into the law of the jungle. :(
The FF Politburo think they can just squeeze the people for ever and the stone will continue to flow blood. After all, they were the ones who magicked money from a bubble for a decade and called it a boom. They have no understanding of economics other than to spout the mantra with required jibberish buzzwords when required.
The writing is on the wall for all property owners and especially the ones with multiple rentals. Before the rest of us get too gleeful and say things like they "deserved it etc, greedy so & so's" etc remember that these greedy dictatorial leeches are coming after you next. Whatever sector of society, age, sex or socio economic grouping.
Even if you are not a property owner or a landlord you need to have solidarity with them because these parasites in power and their banker buddies will pick off each section of society one at a time.
I don't expect a mad max society to happen, but I do anticipate poverty of Albanian/Bulgarian standards and a black market to match that.
The muppets blaming Immigrants, PS workers, Speculators for all the woes just don't get it. By blaming other members of society you are letting the MaFFia off the hook and doing exactly what they want you to do. They want you to blame your neighbours instead of their bad management and decade of fu###ng spin and lies.
 

Raketemensch

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Joined
Apr 11, 2009
Messages
3,075
The writing is on the wall for all property owners and especially the ones with multiple rentals. Before the rest of us get too gleeful and say things like they "deserved it etc, greedy so & so's" etc remember that these greedy dictatorial leeches are coming after you next. Whatever sector of society, age, sex or socio economic grouping.
Could this really be happening? Business ideas not working out? People having to pay back money they borrowed? The men of 1916 are turning in their graves etc........
 

Tea Party Patriot

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 31, 2010
Messages
11,468
Wait until the banks increase interest rates to SMEs and mortgage holders :(

The budget will decimate your disposable income and then in 2011 the banks will come a calling :(

Permanent TSB have already told BTL property investors that they need to start repaying capital.

Rent relief is being abolished and rent allowance is being cut.

Investors could barely pay interest on their mortgages.

Throw in property tax, water rates, increased ESB charges and increase to home insurance you have a PERFECT STORM :(

2011 will not be bumpy, it could be devastation for home owners.
It's going to be pretty rough, and will be magnified by the wider global crisis which I expect to deteriorate significantly over the next year. To put it in perspective it could be the upcoming budget might be compared to death being the begining of eternal damnation!
 

liamfoley

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Joined
Jun 27, 2008
Messages
3,267
Look.
The bank bailout has screwed the country but at least to this stage it has been on a scale that is meaningless to most people. It has been impersonal.
If they squeeze individual people, in other words if the cost is very personal then there will be a lot of trouble.
 

Insole

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 3, 2010
Messages
516
Could this really be happening? Business ideas not working out? People having to pay back money they borrowed? The men of 1916 are turning in their graves etc........
I know all about paying my way and paying my debts. I have no personal interests in property, and nor do my family have any speculative investment properties.
So why would I care about speculators who were drunk on egotism for the last decade, let them burn you say!
My contention is that their situation is hopeless, their surplus property is not worth anything, nor will it ever be worth anything. FF contention is that it's worth the book value because that fits in with their grand NAMA bailout Anglo nationalisation Bondholder rescue plan.
People are bankrupt in all but the eyes of the law. These people might have been foolish and vain etc for the last decade, but they've made their mistake and it cannot be undone.
First responsibility is towards our society, and it's not good enough to let speculators have their comeuppance. By the time we've finished sneering at speculators who simply cannot repay the Politburo will switch aim on the next sector of society who you will in turn sneer at until they come after you.

The country is broke and cannot repay everything it owes, but our society must survive at all costs if independence and a Republic means anything anymore. This is something the MaFFia don't give a rats about.

They are playing Shylock!
 

jcdf

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 8, 2005
Messages
3,738
Wait until the banks increase interest rates to SMEs and mortgage holders :(

The budget will decimate your disposable income and then in 2011 the banks will come a calling :(

Permanent TSB have already told BTL property investors that they need to start repaying capital.

Rent relief is being abolished and rent allowance is being cut.

Investors could barely pay interest on their mortgages.

Throw in property tax, water rates, increased ESB charges and increase to home insurance you have a PERFECT STORM :(

2011 will not be bumpy, it could be devastation for home owners.
I think many of you are engaging in disaster porn. We will without a doubt experience a drop in our standard of living over the next half decade or so. However it is important to keep perspective, we have amongst the highest standards of living the world. And a great many of us have considerable saving and are just waiting for this economic mess to pass before reinvesting our money back in Ireland.

Fianna Fail and the Greens will be destroyed at the next election! :)
 

supermonkey

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Joined
Apr 7, 2010
Messages
614
If you are bankrupt move to derry and go bankrupt. If not shut up and pay your debts.
 

supermonkey

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Joined
Apr 7, 2010
Messages
614
Permanent TSB have already told BTL property investors that they need to start repaying capital.

Rent relief is being abolished and rent allowance is being cut.

Investors could barely pay interest on their mortgages.

...

2011 will not be bumpy, it could be devastation for home owners.
Pay your debts or go bust. If you go bust do it in England.
 

patslatt

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 11, 2007
Messages
13,637
Mad Max dystopia in 3 years when interest swamps tax

Wait until the banks increase interest rates to SMEs and mortgage holders :(

The budget will decimate your disposable income and then in 2011 the banks will come a calling :(

Permanent TSB have already told BTL property investors that they need to start repaying capital.

Rent relief is being abolished and rent allowance is being cut.

Investors could barely pay interest on their mortgages.

Throw in property tax, water rates, increased ESB charges and increase to home insurance you have a PERFECT STORM :(

2011 will not be bumpy, it could be devastation for home owners.
The ground for Mad Max dystopia will begin to be prepared in 3 years when interest on our mounting debt swamps the tax take. Then default occurs and government spending has to be cut drastically to match tax takes. THis triggers massive social unrest,strikes in essential industries and mass demonstrations which the Gardai can't or won't control. Ultra nationalist insurgency movements form. Rumours of military coup abound. So stock up on non-perishable foods,build a defensible shelter,buy shotguns and keep a supply of gold and silver coinage.
 


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