What payoff for busting your gut to learn Gailge ?

Spirit Of Newgrange

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Lets face it. Learning another language is a massive undertaking. Difficult, time consuming, and often expensive. Many across the English speaking world simply do not bother. Ever heard the line "I speak 200 languages and all of them are English.

Learn Spanish and ( added to your english) you can converse with more than a billion people across the planet. Learn Chinese or Japanese and you can tap into an ancient and exotic culture which is still largely intact even in the twenty first century. Many languages like German will open the doors to career opportunities. Languages open doors : work, romance, friendships, culture, knowledge.

And so the question turns to our native tongue. A native tongue that most of the natives have already shunned. YOU need it to be a primary school teacher. Where else is it advantageous? To avoid a drink driving penalty ?

Few will deny that the gaelscoileanna are mostly middle class and mostly for kids with irish parents. Very few of the "new irish" send their kids there. Excellent leaving cert grades sure. But is this equitable ? A kid of, say french German or Spanish parents, can breeze a top grade in their respective leaving cert subject. Not so much the average irish who isn't a gaelgeoir. And the chances of a new irish getting a high grade in history, geography, maths etc...pretty good. At Gaeilge ? What chance. An easy way to learn a living language is to visit the country. Not so with irish. A language that seems only alive in our traffic signs. Personal opinion : Gaeilge is an insiders gravy train which the rest of us suffer, endure, ignore and needs to go the way of the Catholic Church in Ireland. ..ie put in its place.

Welsh is voluntary and way more successful than the ham fisted attempts to prop up irish in the last 90 years. Personal opinion : Gaeilge is headed for the same museum as cornish and manX. And good riddance to it in its current form. THe revival of modern Hebrew since 1947 has been a spectacular success in Israel and has united a multicultural religious unity with regular verbs , tenses, and grammar.

Happily the bad old days of "fail irish and you fail your whole leaving cert" are behind us. But is it still worth the effort ? WHAT payoff for busting your gut to learn Gaeilge?
 


Congalltee

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What an original thread idea.

But can I see the evidence that gaelscoileanna are predominantly middle class?
Or that parents of non-Irish don't send their children there?
And please expand comparison with Welsh with regard to eu language, tv and radio stations, newspapers columns and respect shown by dignatries using it?

Grma
 

artfoley56

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Lets face it. Learning another language is a massive undertaking. Difficult, time consuming, and often expensive. Many across the English speaking world simply do not bother. Ever heard the line "I speak 200 languages and all of them are English.

Learn Spanish and ( added to your english) you can converse with more than a billion people across the planet. Learn Chinese or Japanese and you can tap into an ancient and exotic culture which is still largely intact even in the twenty first century. Many languages like German will open the doors to career opportunities. Languages open doors : work, romance, friendships, culture, knowledge.

And so the question turns to our native tongue. A native tongue that most of the natives have already shunned. YOU need it to be a primary school teacher. Where else is it advantageous? To avoid a drink driving penalty ?

Few will deny that the gaelscoileanna are mostly middle class and mostly for kids with irish parents. Very few of the "new irish" send their kids there. Excellent leaving cert grades sure. But is this equitable ? A kid of, say french German or Spanish parents, can breeze a top grade in their respective leaving cert subject. Not so much the average irish who isn't a gaelgeoir. And the chances of a new irish getting a high grade in history, geography, maths etc...pretty good. At Gaeilge ? What chance. An easy way to learn a living language is to visit the country. Not so with irish. A language that seems only alive in our traffic signs. Personal opinion : Gaeilge is an insiders gravy train which the rest of us suffer, endure, ignore and needs to go the way of the Catholic Church in Ireland. ..ie put in its place.

Welsh is voluntary and way more successful than the ham fisted attempts to prop up irish in the last 90 years. Personal opinion : Gaeilge is headed for the same museum as cornish and manX. And good riddance to it in its current form. THe revival of modern Hebrew since 1947 has been a spectacular success in Israel and has united a multicultural religious unity with regular verbs , tenses, and grammar.

Happily the bad old days of "fail irish and you fail your whole leaving cert" are behind us. But is it still worth the effort ? WHAT payoff for busting your gut to learn Gaeilge?
what's "gailge" ???
 

Spirit Of Newgrange

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Poor people in Luxembourg, Andorra, or Croatia all speak the local language. And what about the irish ? A successful irish language could curb the worst excesses of multiculturalism in fields like taxi licensing , dole entitlement, or social housing. In its current form Gaeilge is as elitist as the spartan culture just before it imploded due to lack of popular support.

We are at a junction in the road : promote mass McDonald's packaged easy Gaeilge or watch it continue to decline. Paradoxically it is probably those very gaeilgeoirs trying to protect the language who have murdered it's popular appeal. What lessons can we garner from other countries ?
 
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PBP voter

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A small few are creaming a fortune off the state because they can speak it.

Capital Grant Scheme « Údarás na Gaeltachta

I know of a guy who go's around working for companies for a few weeks at a time and they get a grant because of his ability to speak Irish.
 

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Lumpy Talbot

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No
The countdown to the appearance of Glenshane on this thread has just begun.
 

ON THE ONE ROAD

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you get the right to brag about a chip on your shoulder. It is not socially acceptable to give out about being forced to learn maths or any other subject and you will be called out on it but with gaeilge people will tip toe around your pain.

Irish is some people in this countries first language. But ************************ them for work, romance, friendships, culture, knowledge.

Most of the place names derive from Irish but to hell with any communal concept of history or culture. There is only the individual. Again ignorance is preferable.

There are very few gaelscoillena, not from lack of demand. The dept of education has strict criteria for setting up new ethos schools in areas were there are already schools.

How do you suffer from not knowing irish? What do you mean put in its place?
 

users

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The biggest problem I have with all the money spent on Irish is the fact it isn't making the numbers of speakers any higher.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2015/0529/704583-irish-in-decline-in-gaeltacht-areas-report/

Also the gaelscoils are useless. But we all know they are just a place to sent your kids to avoid sitting beside foreign kids.
What's useless about gaelscoils, that you can't understand what's said there?
The gaelscoils started long before immigration started in any numbers, so no, we don't all agree with you.
 

Erudite Caveman

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But we all know they are just a place to sent your kids to avoid sitting beside foreign kids.
That's not fair. It is just as much about not having your kids sitting beside certain kinds of Irish kids. We don't differentiate based on race or colour, just whether you will end up in college or not.
 

mr_anderson

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That's not fair. It is just as much about not having your kids sitting beside certain kinds of Irish kids. We don't differentiate based on race or colour, just whether you will end up in college or not.

If you think it's the school that determines who gets into college, you're in for a surprise if you send your kid to one with those expectations.
 

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Spirit Of Newgrange

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That's not fair. It is just as much about not having your kids sitting beside certain kinds of Irish kids. We don't differentiate based on race or colour, just whether you will end up in college or not.
Do we still have the rule that you must pass irish for nui universities ? If born in Ireland. How equitable is that ? An easy ticket for those born abroad and a killer blow for many living in Ireland.

I have visions of pregnant women going into labour in dundalk and being rushed over the border to Newry for delivery.
 
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Gin Soaked

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If you think it's the school that determines who gets into college, you're in for a surprise if you send your kid to one with those expectations.
School + parent's aspirations + parent's own education level + parent's income.
 

Erudite Caveman

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If you think it's the school that determines who gets into college, you're in for a surprise if you send your kid to one with those expectations.
Ah now. School full of kids gathered together by parents who don't take the default options regarding education and cluster together = the norm is college.
 

ON THE ONE ROAD

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That's not fair. It is just as much about not having your kids sitting beside certain kinds of Irish kids. We don't differentiate based on race or colour, just whether you will end up in college or not.
meet demand and that can go away over night. Gaelscoils are exclusive yes, there is a small number of them, that is not from the lack of trying to get more established.
 

Spirit Of Newgrange

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An elite language for an elite inner circle
 

stopdoingstuff

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Also the gaelscoils are useless. But we all know they are just a place to sent your kids to avoid sitting beside foreign kids.
Wow, I never looked at it that way. That's brilliant. I used to write them off but you changed my mind. I am big on racial purity.
 


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