What should Ireland do if Brussels forces a hard border with Northern Ireland?

Kevin Parlon

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Being reported today that the maintenance of the CTA between our closest neighbour and ourselves is now "unrealistic" despite it surviving the dark days of terrorism and predating the entry of either state into the EU.

Brexit open border plan is 'an illusion' and 'unrealistic'- say key figures - Independent.ie

A "senior Fine Gael minister" told the indo Brussels would demand "a hard border between the North and South" requiring it to be manned.

A few thoughts of my own...

Firstly, Ireland is heavily dependent on the UK economy and having trade barriers erected between Ireland and its most important market could be devastating. And worse given Ireland's weak recovery. It seems to me that the desire to punish the UK is more important to Brussels than cushioning the coming shock of losing clear access to the UK market.

Secondly, I wonder perhaps if it is beginning to dawn on Irish people just how much sovereignty has been ceded to Europe. The CTA, something we all want can be removed from us with the stroke of a pen. Ireland is still hopelessly uncritical of EU membership but that might change. We were made to suffer to protect EU banks. Now it seems we are to be made suffer again simply because our desires matter less to Brussels than their desire to punish an EU member who made a democratic decision to get out.
 


GDPR

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Say they will do it and just not bother to; which is what the Ruling Elite would probably do in that situation.
 

gleeful

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We should aim for a special transit route along the M6/M40 and M4 to Dover, something that avoids the need of transit paperwork. Russia has a deal with the EU to access Kalliningrad, so something along those lines.

Otherwise the paperwork will add huge costs to exporters.

Unfortunately, a huge issue as yet not discussed, is many of the Multinationals here have big distribution centers in the UK. That will be a problem.
 

Strawberry

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Being reported today that the maintenance of the CTA between our closest neighbour and ourselves is now "unrealistic" despite it surviving the dark days of terrorism and predating the entry of either state into the EU.

Brexit open border plan is 'an illusion' and 'unrealistic'- say key figures - Independent.ie

A "senior Fine Gael minister" told the indo Brussels would demand "a hard border between the North and South" requiring it to be manned.

A few thoughts of my own...

Firstly, Ireland is heavily dependent on the UK economy and having trade barriers erected between Ireland and its most important market could be devastating. And worse given Ireland's weak recovery. It seems to me that the desire to punish the UK is more important to Brussels than cushioning the coming shock of losing clear access to the UK market.

Secondly, I wonder perhaps if it is beginning to dawn on Irish people just how much sovereignty has been ceded to Europe. The CTA, something we all want can be removed from us with the stroke of a pen. Ireland is still hopelessly uncritical of EU membership but that might change. We were made to suffer to protect EU banks. Now it seems we are to be made suffer again simply because our desires matter less to Brussels than their desire to punish an EU member who made a democratic decision to get out.
You're confusing two different issues - the CTA and the customs union. The CTA is under no threat from Brussels so far, but Britain's decision to leave the custom's union will result inevitably in customs posts along the border. And much as FG may try and pass the buck to Brussels, the reality is that Ireland would insist on customs posts with or without Brussels because to do otherwise would compound the damage that Brexit is about to do to our economy, especially in border areas.
 

Aristodemus

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Britain is going to have to set up a whole new infrastructure at its ports to deal with trade from the EU and elsewhere, pending new trading agreements. The one place that they might not do it is the actual land border with the EU. In other words it may be in their interest to require documentation from all vehicles and trucks entering Britain from the island of Ireland, and similarly there would be free movement of people on the island but travel documentation having to be provided when travelling to Britain. Now everyone is acutely aware of the sensitivities of unionists to any dilution of their Britishness but in the grand scheme of things those sensitivities might well get overlooked in pursuit of a deal which might make trade and travel more amenable for the greater good.
 

Kevin Parlon

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You're confusing two different issues - the CTA and the customs union. The CTA is under no threat from Brussels so far, but Britain's decision to leave the custom's union will result inevitably in customs posts along the border. And much as FG may try and pass the buck to Brussels, the reality is that Ireland would insist on customs posts with or without Brussels because to do otherwise would compound the damage that Brexit is about to do to our economy, especially in border areas.
No, I'm not confusing them. The loss of free access to the market is a foregone conclusionl. The EU (for reasons that can only be vinsictive) want to impose a hard border (manned) between the two countries. Which compounds the loss of free trade with the UK. Not just NI/ROI but also ROI movement to the continent via Britain. It will cost us billions on top of everything else.
 

Kevin Parlon

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the reality is that Ireland would insist on customs posts with or without Brussels because to do otherwise would compound the damage that Brexit is about to do to our economy, especially in border areas.
Please expand on this.
 

truthandjustice

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RTE doing their part in spouting their dooms day twaddle. Britain say they want the FTA to continue between Ireland and Britain, The question now is does the Irish government want the same thing? I hope so but then again Ireland sold off lots of our decision making to the EU for a quick buck. Idiots.
 

Strawberry

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No, I'm not confusing them. The loss of free access to the market is a foregone conclusionl. The EU (for reasons that can only be vinsictive) want to impose a hard border (manned) between the two countries. Which compounds the loss of free trade with the UK. Not just NI/ROI but also ROI movement to the continent via Britain. It will cost us billions on top of everything else.
The EU has to impose customs checks between one of its member states and a country that has chosen to leave the customs union. All the negative consequences you describe for Ireland are being caused by Britain making that choice, don't you understand that? Imposing customs checks and collecting tariffs is about the only thing we can do which will mitigate the inevitable damage.
 

Strawberry

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RTE doing their part in spouting their dooms day twaddle. Britain say they want the FTA to continue between Ireland and Britain, The question now is does the Irish government want the same thing? I hope so but then again Ireland sold off lots of our decision making to the EU for a quick buck. Idiots.
What FTA? Ireland and Britain are both members of the single market, and Britain has chosen to leave. If they wanted the current arrangement to continue they would have voted to stay. Now they will be negotiating with a bloc of 27 countries, and there will be no dividing and conquering either.
 

Hans Von Horn

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The UK will wish to stop Sponger, Criminal, Rapist, Immigrants from getting into the UK
 

truthandjustice

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The EU has to impose customs checks between one of its member states and a country that has chosen to leave the customs union. All the negative consequences you describe for Ireland are being caused by Britain making that choice, don't you understand that? Imposing customs checks and collecting tariffs is about the only thing we can do which will mitigate the inevitable damage.
May wants the FTA to continue, the ball is in the hands of the EU. Ireland should leave if this is not possible.
 

Strawberry

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May wants the FTA to continue, the ball is in the hands of the EU. Ireland should leave if this is not possible.
There is no FTA to continue. Britain doesn't have a FTA with us or anyone else in the EU, they are a member of the single market. Do you understand the difference? Britain has chosen to leave and Ireland will not be following them.
 

Kevin Parlon

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What FTA? Ireland and Britain are both members of the single market, and Britain has chosen to leave
I think he means Free Travel Area (properly, the CTA), not a "Free Trade Agreement".
 

cut the begs

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your forgetting we voted out.keeping bogus refugees and economic migrants out,deporting the ones already here must be a priority.the south will just have to make the best of it or leave the eu.lets lay the blame were it belongs..open borders.
 

enuffisenuff

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Cellachán Chaisil

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your forgetting we voted out.keeping bogus refugees and economic migrants out,deporting the ones already here must be a priority.the south will just have to make the best of it or leave the eu.lets lay the blame were it belongs..open borders.
Well, I'm sure that would be your impression if all you read was the daily express.

Isn't it interesting that the parts of the UK where the Sun and the Mail have different editions/editors are the ones that voted to Remain?
 


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