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What the banks Dont want you to Know


richie268

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Sep 14, 2007
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State ordered AIB and BoI to prop up Anglo
Sunday, August 09, 2009 By David Clerkin, Markets Correspondent
The government ordered AIB and Bank of Ireland to give up to €8 billion in emergency funding to Anglo Irish Bank in the weeks leading up to the ailing bank’s nationalisation in January, The Sunday Business Post has learned.

Correspondence between the European Commission and the government, seen by this newspaper, revealed that the deal was one of a number of measures used to prop up Anglo as it struggled to fund itself in the wholesale banking market.

‘‘Other measures being put in place to enhance the liquidity position of the bank [Anglo] going forward include .. . additional undrawn committed facilities from two credit institutions,” said the correspondence, which was dated early January.
http://www.thepost.ie/story/eymhojsnql/

You either need a lend or you dont! and consider the sums involved ,
Its about time People woke up,
The Government later stated they did not need the Cash .
I have been harping about this for a while,
 
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civilservant

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The government ordered AIB and Bank of Ireland to give up to €8 billion in emergency funding to Anglo Irish Bank in the weeks leading up to the ailing bank’s nationalisation in January, The Sunday Business Post has learned.

Correspondence between the European Commission and the government, seen by this newspaper, revealed that the deal was one of a number of measures used to prop up Anglo as it struggled to fund itself in the wholesale banking market.
So did they actually give Anglo the €8 billion in addition to the €10 billion "master loan repurchase" that the Central Bank gave Anglo at exactly the same time?

And if so, was the €8 billion repaid?
 

richie268

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I think the order was made before September 2008 so if you hang around for 30 years you may get an answer.
Government Policy
 

needle_too

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Could you
1. provide a link to the original article and
2. show where the quote ends and your own opinion begins....please.
 

ang

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Dreaded_Estate

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Well presumably this is why Irish Life and Anglo engaged in the circular deposits to enhance Anglo's balance sheet.
 

DCon

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Should the government interfere in the Market in this manner?

Surely if any FFer/DOF staff or their spouse held Anglo/bank shares and knew about this they could be in trouble.
 

Dreaded_Estate

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Should the government interfere in the Market in this manner?

Surely if any FFer/DOF staff or their spouse held Anglo/bank shares and knew about this they could be in trouble.

I wouldn't classify this as interfering it is illegal IMO.
 

hammer

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It is not illegal. It was a loan. The Permanent TSB transaction was not illegal except for the fact that Anglo used false accounting rather than disclose what the money actually was, a loan :)

Get on those Green Jerseys quick.

When you are at the triple crown match tomorrow have a look and see whether the AIB/BOI/Anglo/inbs/ebs/Permanent TSB corporate boxes are full :)
 

Dreaded_Estate

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Not if the sole purpose of the transactions was to deceive.

What they knew and when

Neary retired a few weeks ago after huge pressure was heaped on him over the Sean FitzPatrick loans scandal. The internal audit report from Anglo suggests Neary not only approved of support schemes to help Irish banks bolster their deposits, but he did not seem concerned about the possible methods. A potentially damaging quotation is ascribed to Neary in the report, congratulating Willie McAteer, an Anglo official on his plans to "manage" the bank's balance sheet. "Fair play to you, Willie," Neary is alleged to have said. Neary retired before the latest controversy about the deposits erupted.
Read more: Finance officials ?furious? | Irish Examiner
One document recalls a conversation last September when the bank’s then finance director Willie McAteer told the then financial regulator Patrick Neary that he would be "managing" the bank’s balance sheets. The document records Mr Neary’s response as "Fair play to you, Willie." Mr McAteer resigned and Mr Neary retired since the extent of the now nationalised bank’s problems came to light late last year.

A separate transcript of a phone call between the bank and the regulator’s office records bank officials explaining what they were doing to "manipulate our balance sheet" and make sure it "looks as good as possible" to which a regulator’s official replies: "OK, that’s grand."
 

cHeal

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That sounds like fraud to me. And it seems to have been mandated by the government. Astonishing.
 

FionnMc

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Silly question no doubt but how can the Govt. order AIB and BOI to give money to Anglo?
Was this all happening when they seemingly couldn't persuade the same banks to lend to SMEs who were/are desperately crying out for credit?
 

Sync

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Well presumably this is why Irish Life and Anglo engaged in the circular deposits to enhance Anglo's balance sheet.
No, completely different scenario. The Irish Life loan itself was fine, the way it was reported certainly was not.

In general I've no issue with this. Governments all around the world took extraordinary measures around the same time to prevent their country's banks collapsing.

As for the title...the Government mightn't be happy about people knowing this, as it betrays the doubts they had about how to handle Anglo. AIB and BOI couldn't care less if people know or not though. It's not going to affect them one way or the other.
 

goosebump

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I can't see what the big deal with this is.

It looks like another one of those stories that describes a complex banking operation, but which because it contains a reference to Anglo, triggers the usual bout of conspiratorial drivel.

This is backed up by the fact that it appeared in the Sunday Business Post, which is 2% news and 98% padding.

All lending in the domestic banks was covered by the Government Guarantee at the time, so there was no risk in domestic banks making credit lines available to each other, and Anglo was having serious liquidity problems, so it made sense that 'cash' was moved around in the system to make sure that nobody went bust.

This move deserves praise, not criticism. It probably saved the banking system.
 

Cassandra Syndrome

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I can't see what the big deal with this is.

It looks like another one of those stories that describes a complex banking operation, but which because it contains a reference to Anglo, triggers the usual bout of conspiratorial drivel.

This is backed up by the fact that it appeared in the Sunday Business Post, which is 2% news and 98% padding.

All lending in the domestic banks was covered by the Government Guarantee at the time, so there was no risk in domestic banks making credit lines available to each other, and Anglo was having serious liquidity problems, so it made sense that 'cash' was moved around in the system to make sure that nobody went bust.

This move deserves praise, not criticism. It probably saved the banking system.
Why did the "banking system" need saving in the first place?
 

richie268

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If I am correct this issue is outside the time frame which exists in the remit of the banking enquiry !
 

Mic

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Fixed that for ya, goose :)
I can't see what the big deal with this is.

It looks like another one of those stories that describes a complex banking operation, but which because it contains a reference to Anglo, triggers the usual bout of conspiratorial drivel.

This is backed up by the fact that it appeared in the Sunday Business Post, which is 2% news and 98% padding.

All lending in the domestic banks was covered by the Government Guarantee at the time, so there was huge risk in domestic banks not making credit lines available to each other when Anglo was having serious liquidity problems, so it made sense that 'cash' was moved around in the system to make sure that nobody went bust.

This move deserves praise, not criticism. It probably saved the country!.
 
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richie268

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How did they plug the hole?
The Irish Times - Monday, April 5, 2010
Government asked AIB and BoI to help save Anglo
SIMON CARSWELL Finance Correspondent

ALLIED IRISH Banks (AIB) and Bank of Ireland (BoI) were asked during crisis talks on the night the Government bank guarantee was introduced in late September 2008 how much they could provide in liquidity to Anglo Irish Bank, according to well-placed sources.

During emergency discussions with the Government and senior regulatory officials, both banks consulted their treasury departments shortly after talks began late on Monday, September 29th.

Both heard from their treasury units within hours and determined that they each could provide €5 billion in loans to keep Anglo float.

The two banks believed that the loans to Anglo, which had haemorrhaged deposits during September 2008 at the height of the financial crisis, would be only temporary and that Anglo would be nationalised the following weekend.

Nationalisation was regarded as impossible midweek while markets were open, as it would affect the other listed institutions.

AIB and BoI both sought assurances from the Government that night that the €10 billion would be repaid that Friday ahead of the Government’s expected nationalisation of Anglo.

The following day, neither bank was contacted by the Central Bank, the Financial Regulator or Anglo in relation to the loans of €10 billion, or received any explanation as to why the loans weren’t needed.

Following the Government’s announcement of the system-wide deposits and funding guarantee early on September 30th, deposits flooded into the Irish banks.

Five months later it also emerged that Irish Life Permanent (ILP) provided €3.45 billion in temporary loans to Anglo on the day of the guarantee – in addition to €4 billion loaned by ILP to Anglo earlier that week – and that the two had also supported each other with liquidity earlier that year. The €7.45 billion in loans are now being investigated by gardaí.

Last week Labour leader Eamon Gilmore called on the Taoiseach to publish all advice on which the decision was made to include Anglo in the guarantee.

In response, Mr Cowen said that the decision to guarantee the six domestic institutions was in line with advice provided that night by the Central Bank, the regulator, and senior officials of the Department of Finance and the National Treasury Management Agency.

Documents supporting that decision would be made available to the inquiries being carried out into the banking crisis, he said.

The country’s two largest banks sought to become involved in the emergency talks on that night of September 29th-30th, 2008, after the collapse of US bank Lehman Brothers froze the wholesale money markets, sparking a chain of bank rescues across the globe.

On Monday, September 29th, Irish shares fell the most in a quarter of a century. Anglo was the worst hit Irish bank, dropping 46 per cent, and was facing full collapse the following morning after the US Congress rejected a banking bailout deal overnight.

The two banks entered the talks that evening after they requested, through contacts at one of the banks, to discuss the intensifying crisis facing the banking system.

Banking sources differ on what the two financial institutions wanted at the meeting. Sources with knowledge of AIB’s position on the night said the bank sought no support for itself but pressed that the Government needed to act to prevent Anglo’s collapse.

The sources claimed that the senior bankers in attendance – Dermot Gleeson, then chairman of AIB, and then chief executive Eugene Sheehy – were told the State had prepared a guarantee scheme that could protect the entire system but that they would have to ask the Government for it.

BoI, which was represented by then chief executive Brian Goggin and governor Richard Burrows, argued for Anglo to be nationalised and the other institutions guaranteed, according to sources familiar with its position that night.
 

richie268

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No, completely different scenario. The Irish Life loan itself was fine, the way it was reported certainly was not.

In general I've no issue with this. Governments all around the world took extraordinary measures around the same time to prevent their country's banks collapsing.

As for the title...the Government mightn't be happy about people knowing this, as it betrays the doubts they had about how to handle Anglo. AIB and BOI couldn't care less if people know or not though. It's not going to affect them one way or the other.
I have wrote about on numerous occasions on this site and people do care, Brian knew about this and so did Lenny and many others, FFS sake I knew and its all dodgey .
In todays Sunday Mail. (no link)
Mr Drumm claims that Government ministers called AIB and BOI and forced them to come up with 5billion emergency line for anglo.
Amazing Stuf
So the SBP says ordered and the mail says forced and I say it was at least 9billion.Where do we go from here?
 

richie268

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[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnEWxNFHyW4]YouTube - CAN ONE BANK ???[/ame]
 
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