Whither Saudi Arabia?


Jack Walsh

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A country that will have no friends at all when the oil runs out.



They didn't just kill the guy they tortured him and then killed and dismembered him. Saudi believes they can act with total impunity as Israel does. What they already are doing in Yemen is proof that they can and do.
Yes, and of course the common denominator is that both these brutal and arrogant countries do so, because they believe there will be little consequence bar lip service, from their great ally.
The greatest atrocities are perpetrated by those whop believe those atrocities can be done with little consequence.
The Saudis see their current relationship with Trump as a carte blanche to do crap like this.
It is yet another example of an undemocratic country flattering the imbecile for its own gain, and yet again, it looks like a smart strategy.


Steve Mnuchin has said he intends to attend the massive Saudi Investment Summit next week, while his equivalents worldwide pull out.
But Mnuchin is your classic Wall St sociopath, he cares about one thing above all else, money
 

Hillmanhunter1

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Anodyne response from the Europeans:

“Germany, the United Kingdom and France share the grave concern expressed by others including [EU foreign policy chief Federica] Mogherini and [United Nations Secretary General António] Guterres, and are treating this incident with the utmost seriousness,” the foreign ministers of Europe’s three largest countries said in a joint statement Sunday.

“There needs to be a credible investigation to establish the truth about what happened, and — if relevant — to identify those bearing responsibility for the disappearance of Jamal Khashoggi, and ensure that they are held to account.”

Germany, UK, France urge POLITICO
 

owedtojoy

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The Trump Administration is sounding less and less convincing on the Kashoggi.

If bin Salman was a Prime Minister, he could be fired and face saved. But he is Heir to the Throne, and cannot publicly be reprimanded, He has proved himself both reckless and incompetent, with mad escapades like kidnapping the Prime Minister of Lebanon.

NYT:

If a Prince Murders a Journalist, That’s Not a Hiccup
In the end, Saudi Arabia played Kushner, Trump and his other American acolytes for suckers.
Trump and Kushner will save Salman's ass for him - in the end, money will talk loudest with them. There is big Saudi money in Murdoch's News International, so expect them to fudge as well.
 

Wascurito

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Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman is the loosest of loose cannons. It's clear now that for him this process of reform (e.g. letting women drive) wasn't a principled stance at moving his country out of the Middle Ages. Rather, he saw it as a vehicle for maximising his power by advancing his profile on the world stage. The wheels are coming off that vehicle.
 

middleground

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Donald, a man of action:

"I will be calling, at some point, King Salman, I'll be speaking to him pretty soon," Trump said.

Usual modus operandi is to create another media diversion to take this out of the headlines. Maybe roll out the old chemical weapons one more time.
 

Karloff

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Donald, a man of action:

"I will be calling, at some point, King Salman, I'll be speaking to him pretty soon," Trump said.

Usual modus operandi is to create another media diversion to take this out of the headlines. Maybe roll out the old chemical weapons one more time.
It was implied that this is specially unacceptable because he was a journalist. I do not agree that this is worthy of action and the bloodbath against an entire people in Yemen is not, but Trump, May etc are quiet sponsors and partners in Arabia's actions in Yemen.

MBS was being shaped up to be a new Paul Kagame, a man celebrated and praised in the Western media as a kind of saviour figure for his country, a kind of liberal, a modern man who can be toasted and called a statesman - while at the same time be a most genocidal cruel despot.
 

Ardillaun

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It was implied that this is specially unacceptable because he was a journalist. I do not agree that this is worthy of action and the bloodbath against an entire people in Yemen is not, but Trump, May etc are quiet sponsors and partners in Arabia's actions in Yemen.
But, with a little luck, criticism of the assassination may lead to a wider review of KSA foreign policy by the West. If they're going to react hysterically to sensible statements about the murder with threats to turn to Putin, why not stay going and get a few more things off your chest? Yemen is a humanitarian catastrophe that shames Britain and the US, and the Saudis have zero chance of winning that war.
 

Hillmanhunter1

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The shake-down of the Saudis by the Turks begins:

"Saudi King Salman called President Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, thanking him for the recently formed joint Turkish-Saudi working group to investigate the disappearance of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, who is feared to have been murdered by a team of Saudi agents in the kingdom's Istanbul consulate."

Saudi King Salman thanks Erdoğan for joint working group on Khashoggi - Daily Sabah

The interesting thing is that the "working group" appears to be conducting its work in Ankara, and not in Istanbul. There will be no joint investigation of the consulate.

The only issue to be addressed by the working group is the quantum of the tribute that the Al Sauds must pay to the Turks.
 

yosef shompeter

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Trump is sending (bagman) Mike Pompeo to meet with the King

[url="https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/oct/15/turkey

This is going to be very expensive for KSA!
Regretably I could not get through on your link.
Some bright spark earlier pointed out that Erdogon executes people too. Also the mass starvation "allowed" by the brits and murkins in Yemen shows that it's remarkable that they'd be shedding tears for that Kashoggi guy.
I recall reading somewhere that he had been in the inner circle of the super rich Saudi society and may have had info on 9/11.
Other than that, the only reasons that I can find for this great hullabaloo is that
1) He was a journalist working for the Washington post and Criticizing MBS
2) In the wake of the Skripal affair and that Bulgarian journalist who was done in, perhaps the News media and politicians have decided to create a hue and cry.

Your suggestion that the Saudis are going to pay off the Turks????

This would seem to imply that the Turks were rubbing their hands when it happened and had $$ ) signs in their eyes when they got the recording.

The Saudis are praying to Allah for something. The equivalent of Michael Jackson being arrested, another earthquake, anything to divert media attention
 

mr_anderson

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Why do the Turks dislike the Saudis ?
Or is it just a case of 'everyone hates the Saudis'.
 

Hillmanhunter1

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Why do the Turks dislike the Saudis ?
Or is it just a case of 'everyone hates the Saudis'.
Well, firstly remember that the Turks (and the Iranians for that matter) are not Arabs, so they are different peoples. The Turks, then called the Ottomans, were the colonial power in Arabia (mainly the Hejaz area) up until the First World War.

I'm not sure that the Turks and the Saudis dislike each other (not at the level of individuals anyway), but they are regional rivals.
 

firefly123

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Why do the Turks dislike the Saudis ?
Or is it just a case of 'everyone hates the Saudis'.
Probably because the Saudis follow the gourd whilst the Turks follow the shoe.

Usual stuff
 

Shpake

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Why do the Turks dislike the Saudis ?
Or is it just a case of 'everyone hates the Saudis'.
Cuzz dey got da munnee

and they've got a reputation for being arrogant bar_stewards
 

Shpake

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Interesting entry from Wiki
Adnan Khashoggi - Wikipedia
The name Kashoggi had my memory cells ringing and I came up with something.
Adnan Kashoggi was a Saudi businessman in the arms trade... had a lavish lifestyle and hung around UK I think. But lo and behold, the bloke who was disappeared in the Saudi Consulate was his nephew.
Seems he also was related to Dodi Fayed, Princess Diana's flame.
Had various connections with the Lockheed corp and made loads of money arranging deals.
enjoy.

So it seems he and nephew Jamal were very well connected.... and probably knew too much.

So Jamal wasn't just any 5-8 Churnalist.
 

Shpake

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More from that wiki page:
Native name عدنان خاشقجي
Born 25 July 1935
Mecca, Saudi Arabia
Died 6 June 2017 (aged 81)
London, England
Nationality Saudi Arabia
Occupation International businessman
Spouse(s) Soraya Khashoggi (m. 1961; div. 1979)
Shahpari Azam Zanganeh (m. 1991; div. 2014)
Lamia Khashoggi (m. 1979)
Children 8, including Nabila Khashoggi
Parent(s) Mohammad Khashoggi
Samiha Ahmed
Relatives Samira Khashoggi (sister)
Soheir Khashoggi (sister)
Dodi Fayed (nephew)
Jamal Khashoggi (nephew[1])
 

middleground

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Donald says it was rogues while media reports about an admittance of murder by Saudi Arabia:

According to CNN, however, a still-unpublished government report will blame Khashoggi’s death on an attempted abduction and botched questioning, “carried out without clearance and transparency” and say that those involved will be held responsible. This is based on two anonymous sources that reportedly spoke to CNN’s correspondents, and has not been independently confirmed.
 

middleground

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Interesting entry from Wiki
Adnan Khashoggi - Wikipedia
The name Kashoggi had my memory cells ringing and I came up with something.
Adnan Kashoggi was a Saudi businessman in the arms trade... had a lavish lifestyle and hung around UK I think. But lo and behold, the bloke who was disappeared in the Saudi Consulate was his nephew.
Seems he also was related to Dodi Fayed, Princess Diana's flame.
Had various connections with the Lockheed corp and made loads of money arranging deals.
enjoy.

So it seems he and nephew Jamal were very well connected.... and probably knew too much.

So Jamal wasn't just any 5-8 Churnalist.
Do you mean journalist or is Churnalist some mysterious way to denigrate him? Are you saying his murder was okay? Maybe you should stay underground out of sight?

Cleaners enter consulate.

Donald reminds us of 110 billion dollars arms contracts.

EU mulls over how to be an invisible ostrich.
 

gijoe

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Donald says it was rogues while media reports about an admittance of murder by Saudi Arabia:

According to CNN, however, a still-unpublished government report will blame Khashoggi’s death on an attempted abduction and botched questioning, “carried out without clearance and transparency” and say that those involved will be held responsible. This is based on two anonymous sources that reportedly spoke to CNN’s correspondents, and has not been independently confirmed.
Sounds as if some of the lower level lads are going to lose their heads (literally) over this. Odd how an an autopsy expert just happened to be one of the Saudis that jetted in for this 'accident' all the same!!
 
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