Who are the Governments economic advisors?

Gael Nua

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Who are the Governments, or more pertinently Brian Lenihans, economic advisors? For when the time comes to eventually lay specific blame for what has and is about to ensue, it is mostly to these people that we should turn to castigate. None of us are under any illusion that Brian lenihan comes up with this by himself - he sits in a room, listens to the advise and either, depending on the number of advisors, goes with the majority decision or tosses a coin.


And on this, who are FFs political advisors who must clearly advocate lying to the Public on our true economic situation, rather than being straight and upfront? A reckoning should arrive there too in future times.
 


droghedasouth

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Jim O'Leary has recently taken the Lenny shilling. He was a PD with an FG background.

Alan Ahearne took the shilling last year.
 

ocoonassa

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Who are the Governments, or more pertinently Brian Lenihans, economic advisors?
EU mandarins and assorted bondholders of Anglo Irish.
 

MPB

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Probably the tea lady at Arthur Cox and Associates.
 

sport02

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Proably the same one's as five/ten years ago.
God held us.
 

Oldira1

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Based on their figures, probably the best and brightest at Ernest & Young.

May God have mercy on us all.
 

WTTR

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CIF until recently! But you can't blame the CIF if they found the politicians in power to be a soft touch! Tom thought he was getting the real Plum Job when he left politics; the place where the real power in the country resided!

Everybody else were such pansies that they just jumped to the tune of the CIF/Politico establishment.

But Tom has since learned that the real power in a modern liberal society always was and always will be with the International Financial Buccaneers, who have us now by the short and curlies.
 

imokyrok

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athlonedub

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Speaking of economic advisers apparently the amazing low corporate tax we offer isn't even being paid by large companies like google who use a tax avoidance scheme they call the "Double Irish" to get out of paying tax in the US and Ireland.

Google 2.4% Rate Shows How $60 Billion Lost to Tax Loopholes - Bloomberg
Has a lot of the pieces of the jigsaw but hasn't put them all fully together correctly......Really does point out though a fundamental flaw in the US system which encourages US companies to get valuable IP out of there soonest.....
 

imokyrok

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Has a lot of the pieces of the jigsaw but hasn't put them all fully together correctly......Really does point out though a fundamental flaw in the US system which encourages US companies to get valuable IP out of there soonest.....
I'd be more concerned about the fundamental flaw in our system. We are the ones on the verge of bankruptcy and yet if that article is correct large companies are screwing the country out of taxes and apparently of the Dept of Finance is using political nonsense speech to comment on the issue.

Eoin Dorgan, a spokesman for the Irish Department of Finance, declined to comment on Google’s strategies specifically. “Ireland always seeks to ensure that the profits charged in Ireland fully reflect the functions, assets and risks located here by multinational groups,” he said.
 

athlonedub

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Actually Imokyrok the comment that the profits charged in Ireland reflect the "functions, assets and risks" carried on here is a comment that reflects OECD principles and would be echoed by virtually all Finance \ Revenue authorities around the world. This is the bedrock principle on which virtually all corporate tax systems base their corporate taxing rights.

It seems from the article that in all the instances quoted, the IP is not in Ireland. Thus the Irish company has to pay for the use of that IP by way of this royalty stream. Again nearly every country would accept this under OECD principles and such royalty streams would be common in other countries.

(The reality is that once such companies have managed to get their IP out of the US (having negotiated the value with the IRS) it ends up being located in a company which is resident for tax purposes "offshore". )

The "OMG" reaction arises from the fact that the royalty stream in the article is going to a company which is incorporated in Ireland but not resident for tax purposes here. By way of background, the principle of a company being resident where it is managed and controlled - as opposed to where it is incorporated - is a concept which predates Independence and has nothing to do with international tax planning. In fact the use of an Irish incorporated but non residnet company has more to do with complex US rules (involving a concept called check the box - but it is real nerd territory!).

So if what the article says is true, then all the companies are playing it exactly by the rules provided

(a) the compensation which the Irish company is getting is commensurate with the activities, risk and functions which it carries on and

(b) the IP company is not resident here by virtue of being managed and controlled outside Ireland and therefore has nothing to do with the Irish tax system.

These are fundamental OECD principles.

The real issue is the US system - they could change this at the drop of a hat by abolishing deferral (thus making global US MNC profits liable to US tax) and dropping the rate to say 25% in the US. Why don't they do it? Because corporate America likes the status quo.

My answer is a technical one so while some of the earlier posters may have a difficulty with what the article is suggesting, that is the law (and to be clear, has been the case since Independence). Nothing new here, no Celtic Tiger conspiracy, no zanu-ff implications, ........
 

imokyrok

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Athlone I'm aware that they are not doing anything illegal - In fact that is pretty much my point. These companies are able to take advantage of existing legislation and policies to avoid their fair share of the tax burden and our economists and politicians do nothing about it. Not only does Ireland provide companies with a low corporate tax rate but it enables companies to avoid paying even that.
 

athlonedub

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Athlone I'm aware that they are not doing anything illegal - In fact that is pretty much my point. These companies are able to take advantage of existing legislation and policies to avoid their fair share of the tax burden .
It really does come down to that net summarised point imokyrok - what is their "fair share" of tax. OECD principles would dictate that the "fair share" of profits should be commensurate with the risks, functions and activities carried out by that enterprise in a jurisdiction. Given that the article suggests that the IP does not ever appear to have reached these shores or have any involvement with Ireland (other than being housed in an Irish incorporated company) then that element of profit doesn't come into our jurisdiction and doesn't fall to be taxed. If one accepts that premise, then Ireland Inc is being correctly compensated....
 

cashinhand

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Dustin the Turkey is Chief Economics Advisor of the Republic of Ireland.

His Vice-Presidents (Economic Advice) include:

Senator Eoghan Harris
Beverly Cooper Flynn, TD
Dr. Dan McLaughlin
Conor Lenihan, TD
Mr. Seán Quinn.
 


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