• Due to a glitch in the old vBulletin software, some users were "banned" when they tried to change their passwords at the end of February. This does not apply after the site was converted to Xenforo. If you were affected by this, please contact us.

Why are FG so wedded to the idea of Water Charges

leroy42

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 11, 2007
Messages
690
Was does a political party, such as FG, risk the one thing they all want, ie power, for the seemingly small matter of IW and the postponement of charges?

In terms of revenue we are talking about relatively small numbers and since the EU rule IW is going to be on balance sheet anyway so the main aim is lost regardless.

I'm not asking about IW particularly, but rather what is the thinking behind FG seemingly going all in behind an idea such that it now appears that they are the ones interested in it and FF (who originally brought in the idea) are against them.

I don't understand the logic
 


Man or Mouse

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 17, 2010
Messages
7,005
Was does a political party, such as FG, risk the one thing they all want, ie power, for the seemingly small matter of IW and the postponement of charges?

In terms of revenue we are talking about relatively small numbers and since the EU rule IW is going to be on balance sheet anyway so the main aim is lost regardless.

I'm not asking about IW particularly, but rather what is the thinking behind FG seemingly going all in behind an idea such that it now appears that they are the ones interested in it and FF (who originally brought in the idea) are against them.

I don't understand the logic
Neither does anyone else. Therefore it has to be something other than logic. Maybe Inda is just thick?
 

Analyzer

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 14, 2011
Messages
45,623
Because the idiots in the nEU empire Commisariat have dictated it, so as to bail out the Seaniebonds.

& FG agree.
 

gleeful

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 7, 2016
Messages
7,520
Irelands water system is falling apart. It only works at all because, like the national rail network, it was built by the Victorians. The nation needs to fix it and that costs money. One way or another we have to pay for it.
 

Fullforward

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 8, 2010
Messages
7,862
They are looking to the future when the Oil Wars become Water wars..........Water = BIG Money!
 

Mad as Fish

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Messages
24,185
Irelands water system is falling apart. It only works at all because, like the national rail network, it was built by the Victorians. The nation needs to fix it and that costs money. One way or another we have to pay for it.
It is continually undergoing 'fixing', the rate of which depends upon the amount of money spent on it. As I keep reminding the IW fans all that their quango achieves on that front is to transfer spending decisions away from local officials and put it in the hands of ministers which is probably even worse.

Now tell us, just how much of the infrastructure is in fact Victorian?
 

leroy42

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 11, 2007
Messages
690
Irelands water system is falling apart. It only works at all because, like the national rail network, it was built by the Victorians. The nation needs to fix it and that costs money. One way or another we have to pay for it.
AS I said, I'm not wanting to start a(nother) debate about IW as such, and I agree that water needs to be paid for and the whole system needs to be managed better and more effieciently.

But FG seem to see that IW is the only way to achieve it, and moreso that IW in its current setup is the only way. This is despite the mass protests, the large amount of unpaid bills, the election result.

Is it simply down to not wanting to appear to accept a mistake? That is the only thing I can think of. They privately accept that the whole thing was handled wrong and if starting again would not do it the same, but to admit that is seen as failure and as such it is the very idea of IW that is being held onto rather than the best way forward.
 

Equinox

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 4, 2011
Messages
2,980
Irelands water system is falling apart. It only works at all because, like the national rail network, it was built by the Victorians. The nation needs to fix it and that costs money. One way or another we have to pay for it.
Typical of FG, their staggering arrogance and refusal to admit a mistake has seen them insisting on 'one way' when the electorate resoundingly told the government to pick 'another' as the payment option.

FG it seems is intent on continuing it's long tradition of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
 

greengoose2

Well-known member
Joined
May 30, 2009
Messages
24,897
It is continually undergoing 'fixing', the rate of which depends upon the amount of money spent on it. As I keep reminding the IW fans all that their quango achieves on that front is to transfer spending decisions away from local officials and put it in the hands of ministers which is probably even worse.

Now tell us, just how much of the infrastructure is in fact Victorian?
The Wavin pipes?
 

greengoose2

Well-known member
Joined
May 30, 2009
Messages
24,897
Typical of FG, their staggering arrogance and refusal to admit a mistake has seen them insisting on 'one way' when the electorate resoundingly told the government to pick 'another' as the payment option.

FG it seems is intent on continuing it's long tradition of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
And the fight was with a dead sheep!
 

former wesleyan

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2009
Messages
25,428
It is continually undergoing 'fixing', the rate of which depends upon the amount of money spent on it. As I keep reminding the IW fans all that their quango achieves on that front is to transfer spending decisions away from local officials and put it in the hands of ministers which is probably even worse.

Now tell us, just how much of the infrastructure is in fact Victorian?
Cork for starters. And that's from a hydrologist . And that's before you get to consider the 45 or so sewage systems pouring into the rivers lakes and sea.
 

eoghanacht

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Messages
32,410
Dinny swore there would massive kickbacks to "de party", it'll make Esat look like a a gift from a corrupt minister, which is what it was.

Probably because FG are a bunch of sycophantic spineless toadies who had it pointed out to them that water is going to be "HUGE" and all the ballsy guys are snapping up water utility companies all over the world.
 

Mad as Fish

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Messages
24,185
Cork for starters. And that's from a hydrologist . And that's before you get to consider the 45 or so sewage systems pouring into the rivers lakes and sea.
Maybe, but Cork does not constitute the whole of the system and since much of the city was built post 1901 it is probably far from the truth to label it all Victorian.

Also, as pointed out above, IW now puts the spending decisions in the hands of ministers, so you had better be nice to whoever ends up with the portfolio and keep electing his buddies.
 

eoghanacht

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 18, 2006
Messages
32,410
Cork meaning Marsh

marsh Meaning in the Cambridge English Dictionary


Apparently IW needs to be set up to do something about something that's been happening in Cork since the place was founded.

It has nothing to do with the fact that water has been earmarked as the "new gold" and water utility companies are being snapped up.
 

farnaby

Well-known member
Joined
May 15, 2006
Messages
1,930
Politicians are motivated by three things: votes, "friends" and international pressure.

So one explanation is that FG's core voters don't care about water charges and are more interested in income tax cuts which will be partly funded by extra charges.

Second could be that friends, members, donors of FG have a stake in IW as it currently stands.

Third is the troika/EU angle, maybe something we don't know going on here.

If it's explanation 1, we'll see a climb down for the sake of power.
If 2, IW will last not long after FG lose power
If 3, any party assuming government will find they're somehow "stuck" with IW due to eh legal technicalities.
 

Mad as Fish

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 6, 2012
Messages
24,185
Politicians are motivated by three things: votes, "friends" and international pressure.

So one explanation is that FG's core voters don't care about water charges and are more interested in income tax cuts which will be partly funded by extra charges.

Second could be that friends, members, donors of FG have a stake in IW as it currently stands.

Third is the troika/EU angle, maybe something we don't know going on here.

If it's explanation 1, we'll see a climb down for the sake of power.
If 2, IW will last not long after FG lose power
If 3, any party assuming government will find they're somehow "stuck" with IW due to eh legal technicalities.
The 'agreement' with the Troika is no more than a statement of intent, there is no actual promise or demand.

The Commission for Energy Regulation (CER) will carry out consultations to determine the framework for household water charges with a view to start charging by the end of the EU-IMF programme period. The CER will also conduct consultations in due course to determine the pricing methodology for the non-domestic sector.
37.

The Government will publish the General Scheme of a Water Services Bill with the aim of defining the regulatory framework for the water sector under a national public utility setting and providing for the establishment of Irish Water in its final form. There will be prior engagement with the European Commission as appropriate, in developing the legislative arrangements.


http://irishpoliticsandmedia.blogspot.ie/2013/12/text-of-fianna-fail-agreement-with.html
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top