Will cuts in rent allowance result in increased homelessness or decreased rent?

theObserver@hotmail.com

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2007
Messages
2,395
Quote orginally written in 2003:-
Focus Ireland claimed today (Nov 14th) that the new changes to the SWA rent allowance system bought in by Minister for Social and Family Affairs Mary Coughlan could actually act to increase homelessness as the safety net of private rented accommodation is removed as an option for thousands of families and single people. Focus Ireland Chief Executive Declan Jones said: “We could now have the crazy situation where a person who is working and has been renting accommodation for less than 6 months loses their job they could find themselves homeless under the new rule where Health Boards have the power to refuse rent allowance to people who have been renting for less than 6 months.”

Mr. Jones added: “With average rents running at least 800 euro a month for a 1-bed apartment this means people could be expected to pay nearly 5,000 euro in rent over 6 months before they qualify for rent supplement.” Mr. Jones added while the Minister has said there will be provisions for exceptions in relation to people who are homeless or where there are “other compelling reasons” these have not been specified and could vary significantly across different health board areas.
Rent Allowance Scrapped for the Most Vulnerable - Indymedia Ireland

The situation has not changed much since the quoted article was originally written in 2003. Currently in the Dublin rental market, bedsits cost from around 400-700eur and one bed apartments are around 750-1000 eur per month. A single person looking to rent a one bed apartment in Dublin can expect to pay around 900eur per month.

A persistent argument is the high cost of rental is being propped up by rent allowance which unlike two or three years ago most landlords are now happy to accept. So will a reduction in rent allowance lower the cost of renting or will it just increase homelessness as Focus Ireland predicts? A mixture of both?
 


Shilts

Active member
Joined
May 26, 2009
Messages
208
Landlords will decide to not rent to rent allowance tenants as it won't be worth their while. Throw it back to the state to look after the problem.
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
15,751
The free market would suggest that rents will decline - I don't think too many land lords are in a position to turn rent allowance away - there are, after all, about 100k too many dwellings in the country.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2007
Messages
22,622
There may be 100k too many dwellings or there may not be but the idea that all of a sudden they are available for people in the right place is kinda false.

Having seen the Local Housing Allowance system in operation in the UK the upshot of this is that many LL decided that having tenants on it was not worth the while as many just pocketed the rent and its 8 weeks minimum before council do anything. Many LL have deliberately decided against HB tenants with council then forced to pay even more for accommodation.

I do take HB tenants (well agent does) but even now that is becoming more problematic and likely that in 2011 this will stop.
 

theObserver@hotmail.com

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2007
Messages
2,395
Landlords will decide to not rent to rent allowance tenants as it won't be worth their while. Throw it back to the state to look after the problem.
Two years ago "Rent allowance not accepted." was practically part of the Daft template. These days it's fairly uncommon to find landlord refusing rent allowance. A lot of the cheeper flats are little more than cages for human battery farming and the landlord doesn't care where the rent money comes from.

The system is also wide open to abuse. I know of people living with their parents but still claiming rent allowence. They have a bag of clothes in the spare room of the Grandmothers house in case an inspector calls around.
 

mindyk007

Active member
Joined
Jun 24, 2009
Messages
119
We are renting at the moment and we got our landlord down to 700pm a year ago as we were going to move somewhere cheaper as we couldn't afford it anymore.now he said its going up to 1100pm again and the estate agent has recommended the landlord to go for rent allowance recipients or RAS recipients as he will get up to 950pm at least from RAS and then the tenants will pay the rest on the side.we cannot find a house with even a little garden for 800 pm unless we move miles from the kids schools.It is mad to think people who are working a re less better off than people on rent allowance .I am not dogging the people i was on RA for a while when i was unemployed but since i met my partner and we moved in together even though we both work we can barley live.with no medical card or any sw we dont even have spare money to go the the doc or take the kids its mad.I dont think reducing it will work though as all these new schemes like RAS will just be the same as rent allowance were the tenant on sw or low income will be forced to pay the extra secretly to the greedy landlords
 

Dozo63

Member
Joined
May 26, 2010
Messages
6
Rent allowance keeps the rental prices high. f.e. in Kildare the max rent allowance for a family with 3 children is 1100 . So very easy for the ll to ask 1100 for 3/4 bed houses.
rent allowance should go down and at the same time force ll to accept a lower rent if they want the tenants to stay, if not ... well try to find other tenants who are willing to pay the price.
 

mindyk007

Active member
Joined
Jun 24, 2009
Messages
119
but landlords wont reduce the rent.they will just find people willing to pay extra on the side with the rent allowance..its been going on for years now
 
B

Boggle

Rents will fall. Fact.

I saw this first hand two months ago when we were looking for houses and started negotiating rent. The ll's were desperate so we could drop the rent to a point but we couldn't get below 700 purely because this is what ll's were getting on rent allowance, thus setting the floor. Were there no or significantly less rent allowance then within a year the rents would be half what they are now.

Fair enough all those specuvestors would lose their shirts but I couldn't care less about them and their plight.
 

Telemachus

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2004
Messages
6,480
Website
en.wikipedia.org
Rent Allowance = socialism for slumlords
 

MsAnneThrope

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2009
Messages
1,807
Anyone attending the next Irish Property Owners Association meetings in Dublin & Cork in mid-November? If the last General Meeting of our over-leveraged landlords in Dublin was anything to go by I'd recommend you bring some extra Kleenex along for them:

Our Guest Speaker was Michael Finneran T.D., Minister for Housing, Urban Renewal and Developing Areas. [...] There was an opportunity for questions to be put to the Minister and this was taken up by quite a few members. The difficulties faced by Landlords were outlined to the Minister and the financial difficultes facing IPOA members were detailed.
Irish Property Owners Association: Landlord Events

"Minister! Minister! I invested in too many houses! Can you help me?"

No wonder Finneran was so uncomfortable when Pearse Doherty called a spade a spade.
 

Dozo63

Member
Joined
May 26, 2010
Messages
6
I am on RA myself. It is rediculous I have to say. With 3 kids we get nearly 2600 each month on RA and jobseekers allowance. I have to earn nearly 40K gross to have that money nett each month, and we didnt even apply for a medical card although we would be entitled to it. Besides that, working will cost you extra (travel, lunch, after school care for the kids etc.) My wife cant work parttime or we would loose everything. Like me there are there are lots of others in the same situation. I am embarrassed that I have to refuse jobs because the pay is too low (which is less then 50K).
 

Telemachus

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2004
Messages
6,480
Website
en.wikipedia.org
I am on RA myself. It is rediculous I have to say. With 3 kids we get nearly 2600 each month on RA and jobseekers allowance. I have to earn nearly 40K gross to have that money nett each month, and we didnt even apply for a medical card although we would be entitled to it. Besides that, working will cost you extra (travel, lunch, after school care for the kids etc.) My wife cant work parttime or we would loose everything. Like me there are there are lots of others in the same situation. I am embarrassed that I have to refuse jobs because the pay is too low (which is less then 50K).
Post of the week.
 

Telemachus

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2004
Messages
6,480
Website
en.wikipedia.org
I lived in other countries, so I know it can be a lot worse ....
Why havent you applied for a medical card?, I would milk the system while I can if I were you.
 

Telemachus

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 8, 2004
Messages
6,480
Website
en.wikipedia.org
It is already bad enough as it is and besides that we are all (5) healthy.

Dont be a dope, go off an get a bunch of cards, consider all the expenses being paid out on the PS gravy train.

When your down in at the SW offfice, you might feel a slight sting. That's pride fu**ing with you. Fu** pride! Pride only hurts . . . it never helps. You fight through that sh** 'cause a year from now, when you getting free dental care, you gonna say to yourself, "Telemachus was right."
 

theObserver@hotmail.com

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 26, 2007
Messages
2,395
Anyone attending the next Irish Property Owners Association meetings in Dublin & Cork in mid-November? If the last General Meeting of our over-leveraged landlords in Dublin was anything to go by I'd recommend you bring some extra Kleenex along for them:

Irish Property Owners Association: Landlord Events

"Minister! Minister! I invested in too many houses! Can you help me?"

No wonder Finneran was so uncomfortable when Pearse Doherty called a spade a spade.
I tend to move flats every six months. This regular moving is actually reasonably common among unsettled people like myself. New scenery, new start etc.

So I've had a lot of different landlords over the years. The amateur ‘lets jump on the property boom’ middle class landlord was by far the worst. They are intrusive as they insist on regular inspections and tend to withhold deposits. They demand their property returned in an unrealistic show room condition. These people bought in to a pyramid scheme and I hope they lose the shirt off the back.

Agencies are so-so. Most are professional and are reasonable to deal with. Sometimes an agent will talk sense into a landlord. They will return deposits after a thorough inspection.

Professional Inherited Landlords are similar to the agencies. These are people who inherited a nice property, divided it into smaller flats and derive most of their incoming through rent. Like the agencies they are professional and expect you to stick to the extract letter of the agreement. But I find them fair in their dealings; returning deposits etc. On the hand other landlords who inherited a single property are in the same category as the amateur landlords above. I try to avoid them but I don't actively despise them.

Slum Landlords. I'm currently living in a 400eur bedsit slum with a dodgy landlord. Most Irish slum landlords tend to be builders or farmers. They drive big cars, dress shabby apart from expensive shoes and the essential blackberry phone. They don't care about references, don't care who you are providing 1) The rent milk keeps flowing and 2) You don't hassle them. If you can endure a slum, it's not a bad deal in the short term. Comparatively cheep rent and no legal hassles. Just be prepared to walk away with a days notice. But I feel sorry for people who are forced to endure slums. I can move when I want and I usually visit the parents outside Dublin on the weekends. Four night in a short term slum is a lot with options is a lot differnt than seven days without options.
 

mr_anderson

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 12, 2007
Messages
9,709
Lower rent allowance will result in lower rents.
Should have been lowered years ago when the rental market price was falling.

In many areas of Dublin, the Allowance exceeds the open market rent.
As it stands, it is nothing more than a landlords subsidy.

I'm quite sure you will get the 'landlord throwing me onto the streets' headline once implemented, however I would suggest the landlord will be using the lower rent as an excuse, rather than a reason, for getting rid of the existing tenants.
 


New Threads

Most Replies

Top