Will FG turn its attention to fixing our justice system now?

Disillusioned democrat

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Now that Brexit is out of the headlines and the "kerfuffle" is over for now can we expect FG to turn their attention back to law and order?

Less than two weeks ago Charlie Flanagan was 50:50 on keeping his job - a pathetic MoJ letting the Gardai call the shots on the penalty points and breath tests - basically absolving themselves of any responsibility for genuine crimes within their ranks.

The excuses were pathetic too - saving tax payers money and the length of time it would take.

I heard some assistant commissioner explain that it'd take 21 (man) years...of course the interviewer never asked why they wouldn't assign 2 resources (10.5 years) or 21 resources (1 year) or 42 resources (6 months), etc....or the fact that Garda overtime for 1 month costs 10 times what they proposed to "save" the tax payers.

Law and ordering is a festering wound in Ireland's society now and FG will ignore it at their peril.
 


Niall996

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Now that Brexit is out of the headlines and the "kerfuffle" is over for now can we expect FG to turn their attention back to law and order?

Less than two weeks ago Charlie Flanagan was 50:50 on keeping his job - a pathetic MoJ letting the Gardai call the shots on the penalty points and breath tests - basically absolving themselves of any responsibility for genuine crimes within their ranks.

The excuses were pathetic too - saving tax payers money and the length of time it would take.

I heard some assistant commissioner explain that it'd take 21 (man) years...of course the interviewer never asked why they wouldn't assign 2 resources (10.5 years) or 21 resources (1 year) or 42 resources (6 months), etc....or the fact that Garda overtime for 1 month costs 10 times what they proposed to "save" the tax payers.

Law and ordering is a festering wound in Ireland's society now and FG will ignore it at their peril.
Law and order has been an ongoing crisis for at least thirty years.
 

Disillusioned democrat

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Law and order has been an ongoing crisis for at least thirty years.
Possibly, but up to recently there was "credible" deniability...now there's fewer rocks to crawl under, it can't be denied or ignored.

The level of arrogance of the Gardai has surely gone beyond any acceptable level, no?
 

Niall996

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Possibly, but up to recently there was "credible" deniability...now there's fewer rocks to crawl under, it can't be denied or ignored.

The level of arrogance of the Gardai has surely gone beyond any acceptable level, no?
I don't remember it being any other way to be frank. I don't know why it's the way it is, all I know it it's rotten and no garda commissioner or minister for justice or anyone in the legal profession or the judiciary has ever done anything about it.
 

Analyzer

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Prediction - there will be a comprehensive PR campaign to convince everybody that FG are solving it.

And it will be as "successful" as the Ministership of Frannie Fitz in charge of the Justice Department.

FG are not going to fix it.

The establishment does not want it fixed.

Crime has functioned as an ongoing stimulus program for the legal profession. It cannot be stopped.
 

Dorcha

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The optics are not good. The government would probably tell us that Norin O'Sullivan did a great job, in spite of evidence to the contrary. It's this ingrained ability to keep telling everyone that black is white until half the people believe them and the other half give up in despair.

Nothing changes, even when it seems to change. At first it really seemed that O'Sullivan was going to make an effort to change the culture which existed under Callinan, even though anyone who saw her smirking beside Callinan at the PAC might have felt a trifle uneasy. As it turned out, there was a big difference between what she said she was doing and what she was actually doing.

If it were not for some independents, none of the festering rottenness would ever have been exposed. For this reason, it is important that independents continue to be elected to the Dail.
 

bokuden

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Prediction - there will be a comprehensive PR campaign to convince everybody that FG are solving it.

And it will be as "successful" as the Ministership of Frannie Fitz in charge of the Justice Department.

FG are not going to fix it.

The establishment does not want it fixed.

Crime has functioned as an ongoing stimulus program for the legal profession. It cannot be stopped.
It'll have to be. The ongoing arming of criminals is too serious to ignore at this stage.
 

Analyzer

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There will be an election next year. And optics are FG's primary concern. Expect a pr offensive. Backed up by the Dublin media.
 

johnny365

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Simple answer is no, the legal profession are making too much money. The debate in an election here is about Garda numbers. This is a deflection, repeat offenders and a broken and crazy system that allows people with 100s of convictions to get bail is the real issue.

The debate should focus on on consistent sentencing, minimum terms and over sight of the judiciary. None of our political class have the balls to do it.
 

Niall996

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Simple answer is no, the legal profession are making too much money. The debate in an election here is about Garda numbers. This is a deflection, repeat offenders and a broken and crazy system that allows people with 100s of convictions to get bail is the real issue.

The debate should focus on on consistent sentencing, minimum terms and over sight of the judiciary. None of our political class have the balls to do it.
The problem is you get these people who look at you with these big bewildered doe eyes and gasp 'surely you don't believe that the judiciary should not be independent?' To which I reply, absolutely. They should be answerable to the people who employ them, the citizens via their representatives. The sacred cow of judicial independence has to be pulled down. It's far far more important an issue than stuff like water meters.
 

ellie08

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Simple answer is no, the legal profession are making too much money. The debate in an election here is about Garda numbers. This is a deflection, repeat offenders and a broken and crazy system that allows people with 100s of convictions to get bail is the real issue.

The debate should focus on on consistent sentencing, minimum terms and over sight of the judiciary. None of our political class have the balls to do it.
Fees are outrageous for some. And you've no comeback. I'm sure there are many good solicitors but my suspicion is that most of them are overloaded with work and haven't time to give each case the time it deserves.
 

Seán E. Ryan

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The only action that will be taken is the only action that is ever taken. They will act to restore public confidence in the gardaí and said action will have fúck all to do with fixing anything within the force. Optics. And you'll take it and you'll like it.
 

Disillusioned democrat

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The only action that will be taken is the only action that is ever taken. They will act to restore public confidence in the gardaí and said action will have fúck all to do with fixing anything within the force. Optics. And you'll take it and you'll like it.
There would be some sweet irony to SF making law and order, justice and the judiciary election issues next year...but I think if they did they could do well out of it given the appalling track record of every political party that has been in government for the past 15 years.
 

venusian

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Possibly, but up to recently there was "credible" deniability...now there's fewer rocks to crawl under, it can't be denied or ignored.

The level of arrogance of the Gardai has surely gone beyond any acceptable level, no?
Once again Broadsheet is excellent at highlighting the lies and corruption of senior Garda management vis-a-vis Garda McCabe
Nóirín’s Prone Position | Broadsheet.ie
Nóirín’s Prone Position
This country seriously needs a campaigning media to keep shining a light on the filthy mess in the Dept of Justice and its unholy alliance with AGS.
 

Alan Alda

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This country seriously needs a campaigning media to keep shining a light on the filthy mess in the Dept of Justice and its unholy alliance with AGS.
Someone like Kevin Myers or Ian o Doherty maybe?
You know , those outspoken radical types that are being censored by poitical correctness gone mad all the time.....
But when given the opportunity , choose to 'speak out' against foreigners and dole heads.:confused:
 

wombat

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Law and order has been an ongoing crisis for at least thirty years.
Too much time spent on law reform and not enough attention on keeping order among the police.
 

wombat

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I quite seriously think that changing the focus of the department to Justice and Law reform and appointing generally liberal politicians to the job is part of the reason the Gardai were left alone. During the troubles, the emphasis was on maintaining order so the civil servants would have tended to concentrate on that aspect and have known how the Gardai operate. Once the focus changed, high flyers would have switched focus to the liberal agenda and left the Gardai alone so any answers to a minister would repeat what the Gardai said.
 

RodShaft

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Now that Brexit is out of the headlines and the "kerfuffle" is over for now can we expect FG to turn their attention back to law and order?

Less than two weeks ago Charlie Flanagan was 50:50 on keeping his job - a pathetic MoJ letting the Gardai call the shots on the penalty points and breath tests - basically absolving themselves of any responsibility for genuine crimes within their ranks.

The excuses were pathetic too - saving tax payers money and the length of time it would take.

I heard some assistant commissioner explain that it'd take 21 (man) years...of course the interviewer never asked why they wouldn't assign 2 resources (10.5 years) or 21 resources (1 year) or 42 resources (6 months), etc....or the fact that Garda overtime for 1 month costs 10 times what they proposed to "save" the tax payers.

Law and ordering is a festering wound in Ireland's society now and FG will ignore it at their peril.
No.

Fine Gael believes in inequality. Passionately.
 

RodShaft

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Fees are outrageous for some. And you've no comeback. I'm sure there are many good solicitors but my suspicion is that most of them are overloaded with work and haven't time to give each case the time it deserves.
If solicitors are overloaded with work, prices will increase. The State has many times tried to put in systems to exclude lawyers (EAT, Injuries Board etc.) but each time clients have done better by employing solicitors.

Because the State just can't help itself. It will always short change citizens if allowed the opportunity.
 

HarshBuzz

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Will 'law and order' be one of the main subjects of debate in the next election?

There's your answer. Next!
 


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