Wuhan coronavirus - Coming Soon?



Orbit v2

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Current sittings of the Dáil are valid because the members declining to take part in votes etc are doing so voluntarily. So long as whatever criteria for mininum quora are maintained, there is no issue. The problem with the Seanad is that the 11 members to be appointed by the incoming Taoiseach cannot attend because the current Dáil (albeit for understandable reasons) is delaying in appointing a new Taoiseach.
 

Baron von Biffo

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Current sittings of the Dáil are valid because the members declining to take part in votes etc are doing so voluntarily. So long as whatever criteria for mininum quora are maintained, there is no issue. The problem with the Seanad is that the 11 members to be appointed by the incoming Taoiseach cannot attend because the current Dáil (albeit for understandable reasons) is delaying in appointing a new Taoiseach.
If the decision to defer the general election in Tipp hadn't been overturned would there have been a problem with the current Dail because no TD was elected for that constituency?
 

recedite

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Current sittings of the Dáil are valid because the members declining to take part in votes etc are doing so voluntarily. So long as whatever criteria for mininum quora are maintained, there is no issue. The problem with the Seanad is that the 11 members to be appointed by the incoming Taoiseach cannot attend because the current Dáil (albeit for understandable reasons) is delaying in appointing a new Taoiseach.
Still not a problem, a long as the minimum quorum (if there is one, which I doubt) is maintained.
 

recedite

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Trump...
The proven way to beat the virus is (we now know) asking the public to make the personal sacrifice of social distancing and lock-downs. That means economic hardship, no matter how much the Government alleviates it. Trump just lost his nerve when he saw the economic consequences.
That is only the proven way of delaying it.
 

recedite

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Are we in the throes of mass hysteria? What can we learn from this emergency?

Interesting article alright. The cure advocated by this French guy is a combination of Hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin. Then there are other variations proposed in other countries using an AIDs retroviral drug in combination with the Chloraquin.
But none of them has had time to go through all the official clinical trials.

All the same, if my lungs had collapsed I wouldn't be too worried about the official certification, I'd want to just give it a shot.

Does anyone know what the current HSE policy is on this?
The two choices see to be;
1) Administer one of the uncertified cures, and risk an insurance/medical malpractice claim if the patient dies. Get nothing if the patient lives.
2) Use a respirator and hope the patient recovers. Administer a sedative and basic end of life care if the patient turns bad. No risk of an insurance claim.
 

jimbohane

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Your very kind to this this government , would that be even praise.
I accept we’re stuck with this government, a government rejected by the majority. I’ll admit that I don’t have faith in them but I hope like most people in the country they do right thing and make the right decisions. It would be difficult to forget how poor they were in handling everyday situations just a few months ago and now they have to deal with a life and death situation for the country. Confident in their ability, no. Hopeful, yes.
Where was all this uproar about cancelling a rugby match. The criticism came for allowing the flights from Italy, which was even then heavily infected.
’Premature’ and ‘timely’ are not words I would use to describe the government’s reaction. Slow and delayed wouldn’t be more appropriate.
What do we know now that we didn’t know a month ago?
We were slow to react even though we knew what was coming, we didn’t need 20/20 vision or hindsight.
Your post would give the impression that we are in full control of the situation and the worst is over. We’re still 2 to 3 weeks from the peak.
Allowing Cheltenham races to go ahead was a major disaster. I have been told by a reliable source that of our 1500 positive cases over 200 either attended this meeting or had a family member attend and that includes those in the health care sector. The problem was that at the time this virus was supposedly only dangerous to those over 65 who had underlying health problems and many of those who had flights and accommodation paid for not in this high risk group decided to take a chance . Its human nature I suppose but it has now come back to haunt them.
 

WayOutWest

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As lot of that may be legitimate.

But, looking across Europe, I see no country doing spectacularly better than we are. You would expect that to be the case if the Irish Government was as bad as you make out. In fact some are doing far worse (e.g. Spain). Both the UK and the Netherlands flirted with "herd immunity" , and both the virus spread and the death rate are faster there than here.

Taking Scotland as an example, Ireland has tested more people than Scotland, on March 25rd it was 10,676 in Scotland, on March 23rd Ireland had tested ~18,000. They have less cases of Coronavirus, but more deaths (22 against 9).

I am not saying Ireland has been perfect, but there was no ideal response. If you want to be totally negative about what the Government has done, your points are liable to be dismissed if you cannot acknowledge what has been done well.
You post as if we’re involved in some competition with everyone else. Will we have some league table when it’s all over. Ireland with less deaths and less infections we will be on top. We’re in fight alright not with other countries but with Covid19.
I haven’t been totally negative about government action but I have no problem criticising the slowness of some of the measures.
When will we see building sites closed, when will we lockdown the clusters . Am I entitled to ask those questions.
 

Pabilito

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Freudian slip by Infectious Diseases expert on Pat Kenny this morning says it all:

“We’re in a far better place than we are now”
 

Finbar10

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Interesting article alright. The cure advocated by this French guy is a combination of Hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin. Then there are other variations proposed in other countries using an AIDs retroviral drug in combination with the Chloraquin.
But none of them has had time to go through all the official clinical trials.

All the same, if my lungs had collapsed I wouldn't be too worried about the official certification, I'd want to just give it a shot.

Does anyone know what the current HSE policy is on this?
The two choices see to be;
1) Administer one of the uncertified cures, and risk an insurance/medical malpractice claim if the patient dies. Get nothing if the patient lives.
2) Use a respirator and hope the patient recovers. Administer a sedative and basic end of life care if the patient turns bad. No risk of an insurance claim.
I suppose a third possibility would be to set things up as a clinical trial of an experimental medicine and get patients to agree to some kind waiver or disclaimer (I assume that's how the French did this). I'd guess there must be some pre-existing framework for doing this. Though, some control percentage of those participating would then probably be randomly assigned a placebo treatment.
 
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WayOutWest

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If the decision to defer the general election in Tipp hadn't been overturned would there have been a problem with the current Dail because no TD was elected for that constituency?
There might be a constitutional problem but I wouldn’t think most in the country would too bothered if some of them were never there.
 

sport02

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Firstly, huge sympathies and understanding for your situation.

But it is not whinging. It is precisely because I see the damage which could be done to the country by getting this wrong which could be done.

Reducing testing and ignoring less serious cases might fool us but it will not fool the virus.

We need to attack this virus with all that we have and the focus should be on testing testing testing. Little point thinking we have this under control, letting people back out into the world and then discovering that there are far more cases than we realised.

Best of luck.
Apologies SIL

I over reacted towards you just not easy and thank you.
 

talkingshop

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Interesting article alright. The cure advocated by this French guy is a combination of Hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin. Then there are other variations proposed in other countries using an AIDs retroviral drug in combination with the Chloraquin.
But none of them has had time to go through all the official clinical trials.

All the same, if my lungs had collapsed I wouldn't be too worried about the official certification, I'd want to just give it a shot.

Does anyone know what the current HSE policy is on this?
The two choices see to be;
1) Administer one of the uncertified cures, and risk an insurance/medical malpractice claim if the patient dies. Get nothing if the patient lives.
2) Use a respirator and hope the patient recovers. Administer a sedative and basic end of life care if the patient turns bad. No risk of an insurance claim.
Latest, limited, study shows no benefits to hydroxychloroquine.

 
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Interesting article alright. The cure advocated by this French guy is a combination of Hydroxychloroquine and Azithromycin. Then there are other variations proposed in other countries using an AIDs retroviral drug in combination with the Chloraquin.
But none of them has had time to go through all the official clinical trials.

All the same, if my lungs had collapsed I wouldn't be too worried about the official certification, I'd want to just give it a shot.

Does anyone know what the current HSE policy is on this?
The two choices see to be;
1) Administer one of the uncertified cures, and risk an insurance/medical malpractice claim if the patient dies. Get nothing if the patient lives.
2) Use a respirator and hope the patient recovers. Administer a sedative and basic end of life care if the patient turns bad. No risk of an insurance claim.
the use of the approved molecule Hydroxychloroquine in combination with the approved antibiotic Azithrmycin is been used at the moment on every consenting covid 19 diagnosed patient in meditterannee infection institute in marseille as in a number of other CHU in France the french ministry of health is conducting a number of independant clinical trials as a number of other countries for the same cure those results are expected in about 8 weeks times
in the meantime any medical team with the agrement of the patient can make the decision to use it as per the disclaimer any patient has to sign before an operation the second batch of results from Mediterrannee infection is expected to be realeased this week
 

talkingshop

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the use of the approved molecule Hydroxychloroquine in combination with the approved antibiotic Azithrmycin is been used at the moment on every consenting covid 19 diagnosed patient in meditterannee infection institute in marseille as in a number of other CHU in France the french ministry of health is conducting a number of independant clinical trials as a number of other countries for the same cure those results are expected in about 8 weeks times
in the meantime any medical team with the agrement of the patient can make the decision to use it as per the disclaimer any patient has to sign before an operation the second batch of results from Mediterrannee infection is expected to be realeased this week
Thank you, that’s interesting.
 

Finbar10

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If the decision to defer the general election in Tipp hadn't been overturned would there have been a problem with the current Dail because no TD was elected for that constituency?
Article 16.4 says:
1° Polling at every general election for Dáil Éireann shall as far as practicable take place on the same day throughout the country.
2° Dáil Éireann shall meet within thirty days from that polling day.
So while it seems valid to reschedule the election in a constituency where a candidate dies to a later date, it would seem unconstitutional to leave this process drag on for too long (and break the 30 days limit). I'm not sure if the electoral legislation really is up to the job for all cases in this regard, but it is supposed to be. It's a situation that's not supposed to arise! :) Otherwise, I guess it's an open constitutional question. I suppose it's possible things would be ok for votes/motions that are carried by more than a majority of 1, making the absence irrelevant (probably not a big issue unless Dáil arithmetic was wafer thin).

The Seanad provisions are a bit more definite: "There *shall* be sixty members". Would the votes/motions of a Seanad with 11 out of 60 members still unappointed actually be valid? Again, I suppose if a Seanad vote/motion was carried by a majority of more than 11 votes, then in a certain sense the 11 unnominated Senators would not matter, but getting a Seanad majority of more than 11 could be a lot trickier than a Dáil majority of more than 1! Otherwise, the Dáil can simply outwait the Seanad delay periods (21 days for money bills and 90 for other bills). However, emergency legislation is not possible without the Seanad.

Unlike the Dáil, there's no particular requirement for the Seanad to meet anytime soon:
the first meeting of Seanad Éireann after the general election shall take place on a day to be fixed by the President on the advice of the Taoiseach
though there seems to be a 12 month deadline:
The Oireachtas shall hold at least one session every year.
 
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