Young gardai take home pay low. However, average pay of all ranks €68,000 plus annual accumulation of pension rights of €40,000 totals €108,000.

patslatt

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Young gardai take home pay low. However, average pay of all ranks €68,000 plus annual accumulation of pension rights of €40,000 totals €108,000.

The average pay figures from CSO government statistics are shown below, copied from a post by Finbar in a related blog thread of mine on public sector pay.

"...In general, though, Gardaí are well paid. Here the latest Q2 CSO earning figures. The average weekly earnings of a Garda are 1304.11, which includes an average of 5.5 hours of overtime. Therefore, their average annual income is €67.8k, which is not so bad!


"Garda Siochana 2016Q2
Employment (Number) 12800
Average Hourly Earnings excluding Irregular Earnings (Euro) 25.04
Average Weekly Earnings (Euro) 1304.11
Average Hourly Earnings (Euro) 30.52
Average Weekly Paid Hours (Hours) 42.7
Average hourly irregular earnings (Euro) 5.48
Average hourly other labour costs (Euro) 2.42
Average hourly total labour costs (Euro) 32.93"
(End of Finbar's post)

In addition to pay, gardai accumulate annual pension benefits that over 30 years of service are worth a total of about €1.2 million in today's money according to insurance actuarial calculations reported in The Irish Independent some years ago. Divided by 30 years, this is an annual figure of €40,000. So total pay plus pension entitlement totals €108,000.

Should the public and the government have much patience with a strike that threatens the security of the state in view of this figure?

Maybe the low starting garda pay could be improved by redistributing the garda pay budget to improve this low pay while keeping a lid on the rest of pay.
 
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Texal Tom

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A good friend of mine is on 12k per year for 3 years for not turning up for work... And now they are going to recruit 800 Garda per year to get the numbers up... Bewildering management of monies and people.

I think the 'rent allowance' is usually nicely tucked away by the unions in their calculations... Apart from politicians I don't think any other public sector workers get a rent allowance. If the Gardai get more money there will be many other groups lining up seeking pay rises - looks like we have learned very little from our pain over the last 8 years
 

nakatomi

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Clearly Pat you think Gardai are overpaid and feel the pay should be cut.:roll:
 

galteeman

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Very interesting thanks. I wonder what their average pay at retirement is? -when their lump sums and pensions are calculated. And also if they continue to receive allowances when they retire. Do their spouses continue to receive pensions and allowances until they also pass away etc. Some of these guys or their spouses could live for 40-50 years after the date of retirement.
 

Finbar10

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The formatted table in my original post in a different thread is a bit easier on the eye:

Garda Siochana2016Q2
Employment (Number)12800
Average Hourly Earnings excluding Irregular Earnings (Euro)25.04
Average Weekly Earnings (Euro)1304.11
Average Hourly Earnings (Euro)30.52
Average Weekly Paid Hours (Hours)42.7
Average hourly irregular earnings (Euro)5.48
Average hourly other labour costs (Euro)2.42
Average hourly total labour costs (Euro)32.93


IMO it is probably indeed a bit of a struggle for a young Garda is his/her early twenties living in an expensive city like Dublin on €23.5k for the first year or two (until €6000 or so allowances for front-line work start kicking in). These new recruits are also without the €5600 rent allowance that older members enjoy (though seemingly this will gradually be restored to them over the next few years, at least partially compensating for this disadvantage).

In general, though, the pay-scales and allowances aren't bad.

Base pay-scales for various ranks are listed here. An ordinary Garda will be on fairly decent base pay within ten years. This will be topped up by about an extra 20% in allowances (had an old link to these on the GRA website, which doesn't work anymore, but linked via the "Wayback Machine" instead: allowances). Plus around another 10% can be earned via overtime.

Spotted the above table on the CSO website. Was actually a little surprised at pay levels. Was expecting a €50-55k average tbh. Seems there has been a bit of a bump in Garda overtime of late (probably connected with those Dublin gangland killings). Nonetheless, from looking at similar past CSO figures, it seems average Garda pay has consistently averaged over €1200 per week over the past few years.

I believe in having good un-spun accurate figures to hand. IMO the Gardaí should be well paid. However, it seems that Garda pay *is*pretty good (about on a par with semi-states like Bord Gais and the ESB). Perhaps, instead of across the board general Garda pay increases, improvements in pay for new recruits, better equipment, and a general increase in Garda numbers would be better value for money?
 

Sister Mercedes

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Conor Brady in today's Sunday Times suggests we look at a Ronald Reagan option for the Gardai and Teachers strikers. Sack them all and recruit new ones.

When you read an establishment apologist like Brady suggesting such extreme measures, you know the PS trade unions have lost the public support.
 

wexfordman

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Pay needs to help regularised also, if rent allowance is given to all and makes up part of pensionable pay..then it's pay bit allowance, so should be rolled into the pay amount, so at least it provides clarity and removes the ability of unions to mislead the public
 

wexfordman

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Conor Brady in today's Sunday Times suggests we look at a Ronald Reagan option for the Gardai and Teachers strikers. Sack them all and recruit new ones.

When you read an establishment apologist like Brady suggesting such extreme measures, you know the PS trade unions have lost the public support.
If the Garda go in strike they will loose whatever credibility they had remaining, they will be a joke of a police force, nothing more than paid security gaurds.

The government needs to.come down very hard in strikingngardai.
 

Sister Mercedes

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Air traffic controllers' strike

In summer 1981 PATCO, the union of federal air traffic controllers went on strike, violating a federal law prohibiting government unions from striking. Declaring the situation an emergency as described in the 1947 Taft–Hartley Act, [President] Reagan stated that if the air traffic controllers "do not report for work within 48 hours, they have forfeited their jobs and will be terminated." They did not return and on August 5, Reagan fired 11,345 striking air traffic controllers who had ignored his order, and used supervisors and military controllers to handle the nation's commercial air traffic until new controllers could be hired and trained.

A leading reference work on public administration concluded, "The firing of PATCO employees not only demonstrated a clear resolve by the president to take control of the bureaucracy, but it also sent a clear message to the private sector that unions no longer needed to be feared."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_Reagan
 

Sister Mercedes

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A good friend of mine is on 12k per year for 3 years for not turning up for work... And now they are going to recruit 800 Garda per year to get the numbers up... Bewildering management of monies and people.

I think the 'rent allowance' is usually nicely tucked away by the unions in their calculations... Apart from politicians I don't think any other public sector workers get a rent allowance. If the Gardai get more money there will be many other groups lining up seeking pay rises - looks like we have learned very little from our pain over the last 8 years
The State media never mentions all the allowances and other 'non-pay' elements of PS pay. Too busy pushing 'pay restoration' propaganda.

People say our State broadcaster isn't bad, look at Italy's. Personally I think stripping housewives would be a higher standard of public broadcasting than the dirge spewed out day in and day out by Montrose.
 

realistic1

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The average pay figures from CSO government statistics are shown below, copied from a post by Finbar in a related blog thread of mine on public sector pay.

"...In general, though, Gardaí are well paid. Here the latest Q2 CSO earning figures. The average weekly earnings of a Garda are 1304.11, which includes an average of 5.5 hours of overtime. Therefore, their average annual income is €67.8k, which is not so bad!


"Garda Siochana 2016Q2
Employment (Number) 12800
Average Hourly Earnings excluding Irregular Earnings (Euro) 25.04
Average Weekly Earnings (Euro) 1304.11
Average Hourly Earnings (Euro) 30.52
Average Weekly Paid Hours (Hours) 42.7
Average hourly irregular earnings (Euro) 5.48
Average hourly other labour costs (Euro) 2.42
Average hourly total labour costs (Euro) 32.93"
(End of Finbar's post)

In addition to pay, gardai accumulate annual pension benefits that over 30 years of service are worth a total of about €1.2 million in today's money according to insurance actuarial calculations reported in The Irish Independent some years ago. Divided by 30 years, this is an annual figure of €40,000. So total pay plus pension entitlement totals €108,000.

Should the public and the government have much patience with a strike that threatens the security of the state in view of this figure?

Maybe the low starting garda pay could be improved by redistributing the garda pay budget to improve this low pay while keeping a lid on the rest of pay.
This is much the same across all the PS and Civil service. Once you get up the ladder the spoils are crazy, but the people on the lower rungs are the low paid. There should be no rise for any Public service worker that is getting in excess of the average industrial wage, simple as!
 

HarshBuzz

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The State media never mentions all the allowances and other 'non-pay' elements of PS pay. Too busy pushing 'pay restoration' propaganda.

People say our State broadcaster isn't bad, look at Italy's. Personally I think stripping housewives would be a higher standard of public broadcasting than the dirge spewed out day in and day out by Montrose.
just fire all the broadcasters over the age of 30 - they are all so thoroughly institutionalised that Stockholm Syndrome set in decades ago
 

tipofdiceberg

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Not forgetting the protection money
How does that compare with the Average politician's "extra" money?

The CSO have moved from leprechaun to average economic reports.
The average wage of a Taoiseach and a minimun wage earner is €2, 173· 00 per week
 
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ShoutingIsLeadership

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Conor Brady in today's Sunday Times suggests we look at a Ronald Reagan option for the Gardai and Teachers strikers. Sack them all and recruit new ones.

When you read an establishment apologist like Brady suggesting such extreme measures, you know the PS trade unions have lost the public support.


Or that Brady has jumped the shark.
 

stopdoingstuff

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The Gardai are generally not necessary. They do not prevent day-to-day crime. In some cases they do not even investigate it. There are certain units within the Gardai that are necessary, but I doubt it would matter much if we cut the number of cops by 40%.
 

ShoutingIsLeadership

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Got to love averages and the inclusion of overtime.

So, 5.5 hours per week is 286 hours per year. Based on an 8 hour day, that's 35.75 days per year. Or seven weeks.

So, these figures are based on the assumption that Gardai can, want to and should be working nearly two months of overtime per year.
 

firefly123

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Pay needs to help regularised also, if rent allowance is given to all and makes up part of pensionable pay..then it's pay bit allowance, so should be rolled into the pay amount, so at least it provides clarity and removes the ability of unions to mislead the public
Are you joking? Unions have been trying for years to have so called allowances like rent allowance rolled into core pay. It's management who refuse to do it because it allows them flexibility to cut it arbitrarily like they did a few years ago for new entrants.
 

Florence

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Very interesting thanks. I wonder what their average pay at retirement is? -when their lump sums and pensions are calculated. And also if they continue to receive allowances when they retire. Do their spouses continue to receive pensions and allowances until they also pass away etc. Some of these guys or their spouses could live for 40-50 years after the date of retirement.
A retired garda superintendent told me he still had a rent allowance even though he had retired over 10 years ago. I did not believe him and he showed me the payslip he got with his pension and there it was, rent allowance. He did not think it was right he had it, but I didn't blame him for not sending it back. This conversation was about 3 years ago; I have no reason to think the system has changed.

Yes their spouse would get the pension when the garda dies - it would be 1/2 or 2/3 of the pension, not sure which. This is normal in pension schemes that the spouse gets a % of it.
 

Florence

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A good friend of mine is on 12k per year for 3 years for not turning up for work... And now they are going to recruit 800 Garda per year to get the numbers up... Bewildering management of monies and people.

I think the 'rent allowance' is usually nicely tucked away by the unions in their calculations... Apart from politicians I don't think any other public sector workers get a rent allowance. If the Gardai get more money there will be many other groups lining up seeking pay rises - looks like we have learned very little from our pain over the last 8 years
Some doctors get rent allowances and there is a dispute on at the moment as some doctors are not getting the allowance despite it being in their contract. I think the rent allowance is to take into account the fact that young doctors can be sent away from their normal place of residence for 6 months or so to a country hospital and then may occur two lots of housing costs. However a rent allowance paid across the board to all gardai and junior doctors doesn't make sense as they are not all in the position of paying two lots of housing costs. The fair system would be to pay the actual rent for the temporary housing that the gardai/doctor is forced to take on leaving him to pay the mortgage/rent of his main residence.
 


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